Public Meeting of Egg Harbor Township Committee 11/25/25

to the stands one nation
indivisible with liberty and justice for
all
>> call please book
>> hereson
>> here
>> Rosener
>> present
>> I'm here
we have no presentations this evening
but Mr. Mr. Watkins, are you going to
give us the road program update?
>> I can give you a quick uh breakdown. So,
right now today, uh South State
Construction has completed uh Kathy and
Camelot uh paving and Pine uh North,
which is um Dogwood South about 2,000
ft. They paved those roadways today. Um
they will be out on Schoolhouse Lane and
Ria on Monday doing milling and paving
Ria and Kate's intersection. I would try
to avoid that. Um if possible there will
be detours set up and then schoolhouse
lane from uh Greenree Church basically
out to um old stage and old stage will
be paved as well. Uh there will be a
detour set up in that location as well
for two days. Um building on Monday,
leaving on Tuesday on schoolhouse as RIA
as well. And then lastly will be paving
of uh ship uh river and harbor drives um
off of summer 200 road and that would
conclude all the paving. Um as of this
period we have to wait 30 days on
Mitchell Avenue. A storm pipe was
replaced there just completed today. Um
so we're going to wait 30 days. I'm
hoping we get some good weather by Jan
before Christmas right after. Um then
they'll be able to go in there and pave
it. If not, we may hold them off until
March when it's warm. Um, but if they
have a good uh couple days, get them in
there and we'll pave it
>> back by Kate. Are they going to what are
they going to put the notice up to the
public? Are they going to put one of the
signs in the road because that's now
we're
>> so they they did
>> what we're going to do is have a a road
a closure at Wedgewood.
>> Okay. and coming off of English Creek
and we'll have a closure at Wedgewood at
West Jersey. So everybody will either be
turning on to Wedgewood making a right
going westbound on West Jersey or
everybody continues westbound on West
West Jersey heading towards Kate goes
down to Grand and makes a right grand to
get back to West Jersey to go to
Hamilton Township. Anybody that lives in
the stretch from Kate's to, let's say,
Roberta in that stretch, if they make a
right, they're gonna have to go through
Brier Cle subdivision and go out that
way because if we try to detour
everybody the other way, it gets really
backed up at Wedgewood and exiting out
of there. So, we'll limit all through
traffic, but subdivision traffic between
Roberta Brier Cliff will be able to go
through the subdivision to the Bri
subdivision for the two days.
>> And we'll have the sign up.
>> All the signs will be
>> a day or two before.
>> They'll probably have the signs up on
Sunday. Um, they won't be up, but
they'll be out there. And then the cops
will be at police will be at Wedgewood
and at Victoria [clears throat]
Crossing.
>> Okay. and they're stopping people there
and then we're detouring everybody again
down Grand Eastbound on West Jersey and
continue that way.
>> Yeah, I know it's an orchestra
area that was resurfaced because of the
gas company. Correct.
>> That is correct. Um
>> it's painted apparently.
>> They they should have restriped it.
There is maybe one or two driveways I
think need to be um fixed out there. But
yes, they did a good job.
Somebody asks me all the time that lives
there. I think he's happy with the job.
>> I think [clears throat] he may be one of
the driveway.
>> Yeah, there there was one or two
driveways that we're doing. And um
obviously all these roads will be doing
driveway aprons if if necessary. That'll
be in the next few weeks um and going.
>> Okay.
>> Yes.
>> All weather.
>> Yep.
>> Okay. All right. Very good.
>> Anything else for us?
>> No, I believe that's it.
>> Okay. Hi, Mr. Freeman, you're up.
>> Ordinance 30.
>> Thank you, mayor. Ordinance 30 is an
ordinance to amend the code of the
township of Big Harbor, chapter 94
entitled design, performance, and
improvement standards, and chapter 195
entitled streets and sidewalks,
specifically by amending numerous
sections of chapter 94,
uh, as well as 195-19A
and 19524B.
The purpose of this ordinance is to
update the curbon sidewalk requirements
to ensure consistency with the current
engineering standards, improve
pedestrian safety, and modernize inlue
contribution provisions.
Public hearing on ordinance 30 of 2025
will be held on December 17, 2025 at
5:00 p.m. Thank you.
>> Have a motion to introduce ordinance
number 30. I'll
>> second.
>> Roll call, please.
>> Yes. Halls.
>> Yes.
>> What is 31
performance ordinance amending chapter
94 of the code township of Bay Harbor
titled design performance and
improvement standards specifically
section 94-21
grading top soil and seating. Purpose of
this ordinance is to update the grading
top soil and seating requirements for
the residential developments including
the submission of standards, performance
criteria, inspection procedures, and
compliance with prinland and NJP
regulations.
Public hearing on ordinance 31 of 2025
will be held on December 17, 2025 to
5:00 p.m. Thank you.
Can I have a motion to introduce
ordinance number 31?
>> Have a second.
>> I'll second it.
>> Roll call, please.
>> Yes.
>> Walls.
>> Yes.
>> Rosenberg.
>> Yes.
>> Ordinance 32 for introduction. Mr.
Freeman. Orange 32 is an ordinance
amending chapter 225 of the code touch
of Lake Harbor entitled zoning
specifically 225-61
general requirements and section
22591D2A
fees and permits. Purpose of this
ordinance is to amend chapter 225 of the
township code by adding uniform address
display requirements for commercial
properties and revising zoning and
engineering fees applicable to new
single family dwellings.
Public hearing on ordinance 32 of 2025
will be held on December 17, 2025 at
5:00 p.m. Thank you.
>> I have a motion to introduce ordinance
number 32.
>> Second.
>> Roll call, please.
>> Yeah.
Yes.
>> Yes.
Uh, ordinance 33, Mr. Freeman.
>> 33 is an ordinance amending 225 of the
code of township harbor entitled zoning,
specifically 225-9,
Timber Ridge redevelopment area. The
purpose of this ordinance is to amend
chapter 225
section 225-99
of the township code by adopting a
revised redevelopment plan for the
Timber Ridge redevelopment area, also
known as block 1223, lots 56, and 8 and
block 1305 7. Updating the permitted
residential development and authorizing
the transmitt of the amended
redevelopment plan to the planning board
pursuant to New Jersey statutes 48 20
excuse me 40 col 12A hyphen 7.
A public hearing on ordinance 33 of 2025
will be held on December 17, 2025 at
5:00 p.m.
>> Thank you. I have a motion to introduce
ordinance number 33.
Make a motion.
>> Second.
>> Roll call, please.
>> Yes.
>> No.
>> Yes.
Uh, ordinance 34, Mr. Fraven.
Ordinance 34 is an ordinance authorizing
the execution of a tax abatement
agreement with TGT
3324 LLC for property located at 3324
Bergentown Road also known as block 5505
law 20 with additional lots of 1921 22
23 and 24. The purpose of this ordinance
is to authorize the execution of a tax
abatement agreement with this entity for
approximately 43,50
square foot indoor sports facility
related site improvements
uh approved on a final site plan and to
establish it payments in lie of taxes in
accordance with the 5-year exemption and
abatement law.
A public hearing on ordinance 34 of 2025
will be held on December 17, 2025 at
5:00 pm. Thank you.
>> Have a motion to introduce ordinance
number 34.
>> So moved.
>> Have a second.
Second. Roll
>> call, please.
>> Yes.
>> To introduce.
>> Yes.
Uh, ordinance 35, Mr. Freeman.
Ordinance 35 is an ordinance to adopt
the redevelopment plan for the Route 152
redevelopment area. The purpose of this
ordinance is to adopt the Route 152
redevelopment plan for block 9401 lot 1,
block 9402, lot one, and block 9603 lot
2. A public hearing on ordinance 35 of
2025 will be held on December 17, 2025
at 5:00 p.m. Thank you. We have a motion
to introduce ordinance number 35.
>> Roll call, please.
>> Yes.
Uh resolution consent calendar. We
have resolutions 545 through and
including 554. Do we have any questions?
If not, can I have a motion?
>> Thank you. Uh roll call, please.
>> Yes.
Halls. Yes.
>> Yes.
>> Can I have a motion to adopt the consent
calendar resolution? Oh, I know I did
that. Uh for the bill list, uh 555. Can
I have a motion to adopt uh resolution
555 authorizing payment of all bills?
>> Uh roll call, please.
>> Yes.
>> We've got some approvals. Can I have a
motion to approve the November 12th,
2025 township committee meeting minutes?
>> Second.
>> Um, all in favor?
>> I. Can I have a motion to approve the
departmental reports for the month of
October 2025?
>> Moved.
Second.
>> Thank you. All in favor?
>> I.
>> Uh, I'm going to move public discussion
up and reports down if that's okay with
everybody.
Um, is there anyone in the public that
would like to address a governing body?
Please come on down and just give your
name, sir. Come on down and give your
name for the record.
>> Um, Jim Berg, 153 Blue Bell Drive. And
you may have already taken this into
consideration. I had mentioned to uh
Paul, I believe, and some other people,
uh my concern about the proliferation of
roadside memorials. I don't know if
that's considered a new curbing
discussions. Uh I can realize I noticed,
you may have all seen at the site of an
accident, people will put up a wreath or
memorial. I personally don't understand
it, but I can sympathize with people who
want to do that in case of a tragedy for
a month, three months. But I've seen
some of these roadside formal memorials
been there for years, early years. And
in some cases, I see people starting to
put blocks around them, making them
permanent. And I don't know what the
town's policy is, uh, impromptu.
They're not cemeteries, but memorials.
You see them all around. And uh I just
think it's something that should be
considered uh in discussions of your
road regulations, current regulations,
sidewalk regulations. Uh [clears throat]
what is appropriate for these things?
Personally, my opinion, 3 to 6 months is
more than enough to have some roadside
stand, not roadside stand, roadside
memorial that would catch your eye,
perhaps even cause more problems. So
that's my comment on that. Second
comment is probably should have gone to
the police department on this. Uh but
signage issue. Uh the town has put up a
lot of signs on West Jersey Avenue
coming from Boss that direction. Uh
pointing out the streets where the uh
bike trails are, warning signs at the
intersections. They didn't do one at
West Jersey and Tmont. And I think that
would be very helpful since a lot of
people in Village Grand turn turn down
that street and at night it could be a
little dark.
>> Can they do this? I don't know a thing
about it. I'm passing it on to the
board.
Uh well, the signs on the intersection,
they show the street intersection and a
little design that showed the bike path.
You probably noticed the signs by
driving down there, but they missed
Fremont. I just think it would be a good
idea to put that one there, too.
>> Yeah.
>> Again, I wanted the fun of coming to the
the council meeting. [laughter]
It's got nothing to do with this, but I
wanted to come about 6 months ago and I
came on the wrong evening.
>> So I came back a month later at the
right evening at the wrong time. And I
came back about a month later, the right
evening, the wrong time. But you had
postponed the meeting for some reason.
So finally I had a chance to come and
just talk about this. The memorial
you're talking about blue bell. Is that
the one your eye or
>> four of them that I that I know I pass
by when I drive or ride or ride ride my
own bike. Okay.
>> And I'm sure everybody has seen them at
intersections. Uh it could be as simple
as a wreath, but I've seen some with a
little monument and bricks around it and
and you know doesn't seem unless you
want me to have other memorials. I don't
know. [clears throat] But that's my
comments. Thank you for listening and
thank you for your service and have a
happy Thanksgiving. Happy Thanksgiving
to you two. Is there anyone else you'd
like to address governing body?
>> Have your name for the record.
>> Jim Papasic 7106 Avenue in the great
Harper Township. Um, I'd like to read a
a letter that I've written in the record
and if you don't mind, I'd like to
approach Madame Mayor and give her a
couple photographs before I read it.
Thank you.
>> Thank you.
>> Yes, sir.
>> Your ability as a
>> I'm going to hand these down to the
engine.
[laughter]
>> I'm going to pass these down to the
engineer. He can take a look at those.
>> Sure. Sure.
For the past 10 months, I have been
attempting to get Ridge Avenue repaired
from Delaware Avenue down to 7110 Ridge
Avenue. I have filed numerous report of
pothole requests and have hand delivered
nine letters to the business
administrator's office and four letters
to the city engineer. The result
potholes were addressed but their
temporary patches failed within 48
hours. As for the business administrator
and engineers office,
nothing has been done. In fact, I have
noticed roadways around my area being
repaired while my requests have yielded
zero results. Basically, it is obvious
that the ground under the roadway is
shifting. I am located in a flood zone
with a high water table. With the
current condition of the roadway,
rainwater is funneling down Ridge Avenue
from Delaware Avenue and 7110
Ridge Avenue, meeting up at the now
portion of Ridge Avenue. The water has
been seeping under the roadway via
potholes, failed patches, spiderweb
cracks in the asphalt, and a 40 to 50
foot section of eroded shoulder on both
sides of Ridge Avenue. To compound the
issue, there are approximately 91 school
buses pounding the roadway every day. If
an average class bus weighs 10,000 lbs
times 91 buses, that's 910,000 lbs or 91
tons per day pounding the roadway. On
November 22nd became personal because
water is now leaking into my home via
the crawl space. I've lived at 7106
Ridge Avenue since 1989. Yes, there has
been water in my crawl space from events
like a noraster, hurricane Sandy, or a
delki water. Outside of major rain
events, my crawl space has always been
high and dry. So why is 03 in of
rainfall now creating a problem with my
crawl space? In addition to the damage
in my home, there are other issues to
consider like pedestrian issues. There's
a park located at Delaware and Rich.
Because large sections of the shoulder
has been eroded away, juveniles on their
electric scooters, walkers, joggers, and
bicyclists all have to travel either
onto the roadway or onto private
property to avoid the hazards. Public
safety issue. Beneath the worn away
shoulder, there are natural gas line
connections in the street. Beneath the
potholes, field patches, and spiderweb
cracks, you're a combination of gas,
water, and sewage line. I get in two
pictures in there and there. On a
personal issue, on November 22nd, while
replacing the moisture barrier in my
crawl space, I noticed a large pool of
groundwater. According to ACE on 11:22,
we received just 03 in of rainfall over
a 24hour period. It's not a lot of rain,
but it was enough to create quite a bit
of groundwater relying in my crawl
space. So, in conclusion, I have
reported the roadway issues to Egg
Harbor Township for 10 months. I voiced
my concern. I voiced my concerns,
provided photographs, and even stated my
home shakes occasionally from passing
school buses. All of my conversations
with the township officials, I'm here
have been cordial and professional. I've
heard comments like, "The road has
always been low. There are budget
issues. My location may be addressed in
January and February 2026.
Water goes its own way and seeks his own
course of resistance. Wind direction
slopes on my property. Clay soil does
not drain well. Hydro hydrostatic
pressure and just dig out a trench
around the foundation wide enough to get
a roller down there and a
foundation. I get all the above. I I
really do get all the above, but no one
has addressed the problem. Where is all
this water coming from? 0.03 inches of
rain should not flood somebody's crawl
space that doesn't flood. But now it is.
So my personal issue besides I have to
remind us of justice council that there
are lots of pedestrians going up and
down avenue with some of them walking
into the roadway trying to avoid hazards
and speeding vehicles. I respectfully
request that the roadway be repaired
ASAP and I would be more than happy to
escort any egg Harbor Township personnel
to to for a [clears throat] walk along
the area that's in pedestrian buses.
>> Well, I can tell you this, our engineers
here,
>> Jim, is there any storm drains on that
Push and Ridge Road?
>> It disappeared.
I mean, a covert out there off the road
>> disappeared over. I mean, what happened?
Oh,
>> I mean, I don't know.
>> Between 7108 and 7110, the county came
in a few years ago, put in a a storm
drain. That's gone. I don't know if you
look
county road.
>> Okay.
>> So, I don't know what happened to it. It
just the laws of nature just took over.
>> Well, that's not good. Well, I
>> I can't answer you tonight. I fine. I
just And I know your reasons that
they've told you are all legitimate
reasons.
>> In fact, the reason why part of the
reason why I'm here because I've been a
pain in the ass. So, I figure if I
introduce all of you guys, I don't have
to bother these guys.
>> Everybody's here. We're all at the same
place. It's a perfect time to come in.
So,
>> I saw that on the agenda.
>> Tom, can we take a look at this in
particular?
>> Yeah, we understand that the road itself
is in bad shape right now. There's a
sinking like the sanitary vein. That's
down in the center. The center line is
actually depressed.
>> Yes.
>> And it's holding water and and there's a
lot of settlement. The MUA was going to
be doing a repave of this whole road,
but they just had an emergency horse
main to repair two weeks or three weeks
ago or somewhere. I don't know which
where it was.
>> Back on Bridge.
>> Okay. Yeah. that took over most of the
financing that was going to be put into
place for doing this because the road is
failing because of the sewer main and I
believe because of the water and the
clay of everything in that whole area.
Um there is a a channel or a creek that
runs
>> let's say
>> and it goes it's two houses away from
you right okay
>> and it goes back behind his woods line
there
>> there could be the water table could be
high
>> it is I'm in a flood zone right so it's
and when you get rain and it starts to
go down the driveway and it gets into
the sideyards um if that's gonna happen
what I want [clears throat] to do is
we're putting together a road program
for next year. Um, and we weren't going
to include this because the MUA was, but
it was on our radar.
>> So, if the MUA is not going to be fixing
this, we have to it should be done. It
was definitely part of it.
>> Is it the MUA forcement the issue? Is
that leaking maybe or
>> Oh my gosh. I hope it's not leaking.
>> I don't know.
>> I don't think it's
a road program for 2025
was approved in the spring,
>> right? So the road program for 2026 will
be approved the spring of 26 and will be
finished for the year end um of 26. So I
think what we have to do is two things.
We have to talk to the MUA and see what
their plans are. If not it's going to go
onto our books and we'll have to take
care of it because it's obviously a
problem. So
>> yeah. One more thing and and I didn't
bring a picture of it, but I actually
saw a guy walking a baby in his baby
carriage on Ridge Avenue
>> and a on a and a bus came down Ridge
Avenue when the guy had to roll off to
the side on the grass and use baby
carrots because there's no place to go.
There was no place for anybody to walk.
I was going to bring if you want it. I I
>> can see it. My mind's eye can see it.
>> Yeah, I got it. So, you can have this
muscle if you want.
Wait, boys.
>> Yeah, it's all weight.
>> All right, thank you. We will is your
number on here?
>> I was doing my deck.
>> And I said, I wonder how many buses go
by. So, I took out a piece of paper and
a pencil and I jotted them down and I
myself was surprised how many buses go
down that road.
>> Well, I was going under. I figured you
guys out. [laughter]
the 91 tons is still a lot of lot of and
what really makes it bad, you'll have
like um six or seven buses come all at
once and know bam bam [clears throat]
bam bam bam and I even if we did that
the um guea or water department didn't
get on the job or if busy
[laughter]
you
[laughter]
>> longer listen um we operate well into
the hundreds of school buses
So, you're getting the majority of them
come down ridge for some reason with
whatever school they're going to.
>> Yeah. Well, I we never had it before and
I don't really mind. It's just that when
they're they're they're killing that
roadway. They're just when you when you
get on the roadway, you can see that the
roads being grooved out and you can see
that the it's moving underneath the
roadway from the buses and the water as
well. So,
>> we've got your number on here.
>> Yes.
>> From what I understand, these two have
your
>> So, [laughter]
um but we will the engineer will take a
look and talk to the MUA,
>> right?
>> Um he'll coordinate with the
administrator
>> and all of us and we'll have an answer.
>> It'll be 24 hours and make sure I have
mix from margaritas. [laughter]
>> But I know your own.
>> Well, I was I was pleased with you. He
was offshore. He didn't care.
>> Thanks. Is there anyone else that would
like to address government?
>> Hi, just name for the record.
>> My name is Joy Irwin. [clears throat] I
live at 140 Burn Drive in Anchorage
Point. So, I'm here to discuss my Sorry,
I do get a little nervous presenting.
So, please forgetful [laughter]
take but I would express my deep
concerns about the ordinance 35, the
redevelopment plan for um Route 152. Um
from the beginning this process has had
a lack of transparency from the
beginning. The marina of of this scale
with a boat repair storage liquor
licensed restaurant as well as a
restaurant as is not only just a small
marina. This is a major commercial
development. Um our elected officials
who sit here today are here to protect
us who take care of our like the people
of our livelihood. Instead, we feel as
though we have been left in the dark
about a project that can definitely
change the livelihood or livelihood,
reshape our neighborhood that we have
today. Um, what makes this even worse is
that this exact fight has already
happened before. A proposed marina was
already proposed and defeated against
that. Many of the residents that have
now it makes um now years later those
same residents that have fought this
fight are now having to do it again.
They're now retired or older and now
have to do this. It's just not right.
It's not fair that their neighborhood is
now going up against these same
challenges.
Additionally, the new proposed parking
area with the parking in front, they are
showing pictures of that were not like
predate my house. So, like I'm not even
sure why, but that parking was for the
residents, not for a commercial um
business, not for transient, not for
restaurant visitors, not for transer
voters. This is just our concern for our
neighborhood.
But beyond this, this plan poses a real
measurable harm. It harms our protected
wetlands. It puts our residents privacy,
safety, and security at risk. having
parking a restaurant with alcohol as
well as 79 boats, marina slips right out
front of my house. Literally our house
is low to the ground. Like someone could
just back right into it, especially if
there's alcohol. And so it really just
fundamentally changes our neighborhood.
And I feel like we are asking for
accountability and transparency as well
as a decision that puts the residents of
the neighborhood that are mainly
impacted within feet of this restaurant
at the center of this decision.
>> [clears throat]
>> So, I appreciate your consideration
today and time for letting me speak.
>> And you know, the public hearing on this
ordinance will be December 17th.
>> Yes.
>> Thank you.
>> Is there anyone else?
Hi, my name is Michelle McGlon and I
also want to talk about 35 redevelopment
plan for RE 152. So, when I saw this was
on the agenda and I looked at the
corresponding information behind the
agenda, it made my stomach just sick
because when I was telling people that
we're going to have possibly a marine in
front of our homes and I I would
describe it as a Walmart. When I was
going through that today, that was two
Walmarts. Suddenly, there's a cafe.
They're going to sell boats up in the
open lot. They're going to have canoes
and it's just so big for such a small
area. And I've been through this before
and Mr. Hodson, you and I went through
this and it took us six years to finally
get it um rejected. Um and the last time
we had a meeting, you said you would you
would you wanted to see that area not be
harmful to us. We know you're not going
to protect us. we're going to be so
harmful to us. And and those are strong
words because any kind of marina with
that big size is going to be harmful to
us. Um years ago, we had a paddle boat
there. I'm not sure if anybody remembers
the paddle boat. They had liquor. They
were peeing off the top of the um the
boat. They were having sex. In fact, I
caught somebody having sex in my
driveway and I didn't see one time
people were having sex. three times
because I had to clog at that point to
walk the dog trash every place. So
anytime I would complain, oh we fixing,
we fix it. So one paddle boat equals 111
boat slips. You know what chaos that is
going to be? And you know what upsets me
even worse is that everybody on anchors
point, we've done it right. We have hard
workers. We have nurses there. We have
business owners. We have butchers,
administrators,
salespeople. We've worked so hard all
our lives. I've lived in Acres Point for
28 years. I retired two years ago with
my husband. My husband asked me to take
an early out so we could retire in
Anchorage Point. And all we could think
about like at 8:00 we're still kind of
day watching the news and we're laughing
because people are on the scoop bill
which we used to ride and and we could
finally relax. But when you look at that
marina there's only one way in and one
way out and he the development plans
wants they want to have like 17 jet
skis. Do you know what that's going to
be like with 111
boat slips? 17
jet skis. They're going to just be going
back and forth, leaving at 5 in the
morning to go fishing, back and forth.
You think we're going to ever be able to
sleep and smell the roses because we've
worked hard all our lives? No. And if
you took a poll of how many people have
retired there, it's a lot. And so we
want you to really consider consider it
because I think if you all live in front
of what's being proposed, he would turn
it down cuz you didn't buy you didn't
say, "Oh, I want to save my retirement
and live in front of a gigantic two
Walmart uh marina." Nobody says that.
They want to have peace, quiet, and have
a good quality life. And that's what I
want to say. And I will be saying that
also in the December 17th meeting.
>> Thank you. Anyone else want to address
governing body?
>> Jennifer Zarnki, Tenno Burn Drive. Good
to see you again. It's not the last of
me. Um
I'm a little bit confused. Who owns
Oberurn Drive?
Who owns it? township.
>> I don't think the township owns a right
of way.
Who owns it? You know, we have an answer
for that yet.
>> This is your opportunity to address the
government.
>> I'm I'm asking a question. I just want
to understand who owns the the right of
way.
>> Townships are responsible for the roads
in the township.
>> It's a right of way though. I'm just
trying to understand is that mean the
township owns it.
>> Question.
She said she said that the road there's
a right of way. So the the road is the
marginal part.
>> What's your question regarding a burn?
>> I want to understand because in your
conclusion document, okay, you have the
redevelopment plan has proposed
commercial
and recreational. commercial and
recreational development consisting of a
marina, dining, drinking establishments,
including a restaurant, a cafe, portable
seasonal bathrooms, bulkhead
improvements, and restoration of public
parking along the east side of Newurn
Drive right of way. So, I want to
understand who owns the right of way.
>> I'll ask your question. the right of
right gives the township uh has accepted
that as a roadway for us to utilize that
property for a public street
>> and there's more to the rightway than
just the marginal road correct
there's a 40 foot right away there's a
margin you would know this Mr. freedom
and I think you're part of the 2008
judgment. Correct.
>> I'm not being I don't have to answer
your what your questions. You have a
statement that you need. [laughter]
>> Okay. This is being recorded, right? I
just want to be sure that Okay. Okay.
That's perfect. Um so you don't have to
answer my questions. All right. Okay.
All right. Well, I'm addressing the
committee because the committee should
be answering the questions of the
residents that are paying the committee
to be here. That's That's and and you're
part of that, right? You
Well, you guys keep interrupting. I I'm
asking questions and I'm not getting an
answer. I actually haven't interrupted
everybody.
>> You're doing it again. So,
>> you just interrupted me.
>> I'm asking you nicely if I
>> Okay. This is your opportunity and what
Mr. Freriedman is trying to say, this is
your opportunity to make a statement
about what we've done tonight. What
we've done tonight is introduced an
ordinance. If you'd like to ask
questions through the chair of any
committee or board of the individual
submitting this, the appropriate time to
ask those questions would be at the next
meeting, whatever the date was listed.
>> Trying to help you answer and get
>> Okay, so [clears throat] keep myself
quiet. I apologize.
>> Okay,
I'm allowed to speak. Yes or no?
>> This is public comment.
>> Okay. And that's my first amendment
right. Yes or no?
>> You have every right to speak at this
meeting.
>> Okay. Thank you.
So the concern is relative to the whole
right of way in that in this conclusion
in the plan that this township put out
uh on Friday I believe it was prior to
this meeting in this conclusion it
states that this plan has proposed
commercial and recreational development
consisting of a marina okay a dining I'm
sorry dining and drinking establishments
including a restaurant a cafe portable
seasonal bathrooms bulk bulkhead
improvements and restoration of public
parking along the east side of Ourn
Drive right away alongside the bulkhead
which would allow for the productive
reuse of obsolete and underutilized site
while also providing overall public
benefits previously presented. The
parcels within the redevelopment areas
is not or is should be not currently in
use. All the parcels are included in the
area and have been determined to be an
area in need of redevelopment. We'll
know that due to its outdated and
obsolete design
vacancy for longer than 10 years and the
existing sub standard condition of the
bulkhead along Oak Drive. The proposed
development will enhance the local area
and invest in the community by providing
a project which will be designed to
improve safety, resilience, aesthetics
in the redevelopment area and
surrounding area. This area has seen a
lack of investment and the proposed
facility would provide a benefit to the
township as a whole by redeveloping the
site through private financing. So
that's a little concerning to the to the
citizens of Obern drive. We're using
private financing to redevelop,
you know, a right of rent over drive. So
that that sounds like we're privatizing
something that's being allowed for
public use. That's one concern. Okay.
Using private funds. We're not it. Does
that mean that we're we're going to give
this land to somebody or we're
privatizing this land? Land was private.
It's it's a it's a right of way.
>> We're not giving anyone a road. Okay.
>> And the details of the plan I have the
details of the plan and I actually have
have Yes. Go ahead. I'm sorry.
>> And I'll I'll be honest. Tonight's not
the night we're going to get into of
that plan because that's on the 17th.
>> Well, that Well, that's what I wanted to
get to because in in your in your in
your ordinance tonight or this 88 pages
of someone, you guys have put in
pictures.
I think this is prior to 2002 in this
plan that you guys put out. It's in your
or whatever it is. So, I don't know
anybody that owns I don't think they're
making turquoise Toyota turf nowadays.
Um I don't know what
>> Wait a second. This is important, right?
Because we're utilizing this as
information. I don't drive a Toyota. I
can show you where my car is. I don't
drive a I'm car's probably older than I
am. So, um, yeah, it's it's funny, isn't
it? This is the documentation we're
using for that for that meeting in a
couple weeks. This is why I'm trying to
get to the point, uh, mayor, that this
is concerning. In fact, my home, there's
a a vacant lot next to my home. My home
doesn't have a vacant lot. It hasn't had
one since prior to 2002.
And then we've got tons of private boat
steps. Private boat steps. Um a sailboat
that before the what was Miss Marie
Michelle the dagget what was it? Lady
Marie I don't know the the his boat.
What was the boat? The paddle boat
before the paddle boat hit Mr. McGow and
sailboat. That's actually standing.
That's good to see it's standing. You
know it's good. He couldn't afford after
the last litigation to to get that up
and running again. That's unfortunate.
you know, a lot of money.
>> Yeah, he said he couldn't afford after
the last
>> anymore.
>> I know he couldn't afford to to pull
that up cuz he spent so much money on
the last litigation.
>> My question is really this.
>> We know you're opposed to this. But
tonight, all we did was introduce this.
>> But you introduce this documentation.
>> One of many pictures in the
>> Are we going to use current pictures
again? I just
>> Well, you know,
I know. I feel the same way. Current
pictures.
>> We'll see. We'll make sure that the
person that did the report is here that
evening.
>> Okay.
>> And but because this gets out to the
public, do you understand? This gets to
the DCA. People see this. I mean, it
looks like Joe Craner at Swirl Burn
Drive. Uh I see on his deck there's a
ton of people there. It looks like all
the cars parked there. Looks like that's
being used for barbecue. So if you took
current pictures, maybe 365 days a year,
probably wouldn't see more than three
cars parked on a door drive. So my
recommendation is that you really get
legitimized, accurate, updated
information in these types of reports
because people are looking at them. It's
embarrassing to the township if these
are I mean again like it's a it's a oh
grand my mom has one of those. She's 77
years old. So you know they're great
cars. Um but yeah, I mean I think this
is this is what's concerning and that's
why I'm asking about the right away
because you know if we're going to put
public parking submitted these pictures.
You're interrupting me.
>> You've been doing it the entire time
you've been up here. [laughter]
>> Excuse me, Mr.
On the on the night
>> on the night.
That's inappropriate.
>> I'm sorry.
>> Has been a bit inappropriate.
>> Oh my good. Are you I'm sorry that you
didn't get elected, but please
I'm No, I I can I I seems like And Mrs.
Nikki, can we stop this, please?
>> Yes.
>> Do you have any questions other than
that some of you don't like in this
report?
>> It's not that I don't like it. It's that
it's it's outdated information that we
get.
>> You're you're in agreement that it's
outdated.
>> I I understand what you're saying. Are
you in agreement though that it's
outdated?
>> I'm not going to answer that.
>> You are, Mr. Hudson.
>> I don't think we can do it in terms.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> I don't know where these came from, what
they were taken.
>> Yeah,
>> but that shel is not floating anymore.
>> Exactly. Okay. We can get that. But
okay. Is there anything else you'd like
to I just That's I think we need some
current information. If we could get
that prior to that meeting, that would
be helpful because it's just really hard
to look at this and understand that
you're declaring something and providing
the documentation to state agencies,
etc. Yeah, it just doesn't look good.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> The 17 IP
and anyone else?
>> Oh, Mrs.
330 Mil Road.
First of all, I'd like to say good
evening to the governing body. Thank you
for being here, giving your time to the
residents. Secondly, I'd like to say I
agree with everything that's been said
about Anchorage Point, and I understand
that December 17th is the time to have
that discussion. However, I am up here
to discuss ordinance number 33, and I'd
like clarification before I request
something be read into the record. Am I
understanding that this redevelopment
plan was executed I think the date or
used earlier was 2023. Could someone
please confirm that that was the date
that was used earlier
>> this evening? 2023.
So that was the date. Okay. So, I'd like
this read into the record
and be able to be used at the December
17th meeting when you are considering
the redevelopment plan of Timber Ridge
uh redevelopment ordinance number 33.
This is out of the special meeting
minutes on Thursday, September 1st of
2022.
>> Can you give me that date again?
>> Certainly. I can give you a copy of the
minutes if you'd like it as well.
Thursday, September 1st, 2022, 3M
special meeting minutes.
And again, I'd like this to be into the
record. Mayor Hodson called upon planner
Vincent Palestina of Palestine
Associates
to provide an overview of the Timber
Ridge redevelopment plan. Mr. Paulina
stated that the property is zoned
highway business
and had prior approvals for construction
of a movie theater.
However, that plan never came to
fruition and he does not believe that it
will ever be a developed commercial
property.
Since the property has been vacant for
over 10 years,
it [clears throat] met the criteria to
be an area in need of redevelopment.
The original plan
included
commercial development along the Black
Horse Pike and residential development
of 252
market rate units in the RG4 zone.
However, the RG4ZO
triggered the affordable housing
component
and the Pelands Commission also required
Pineland's development credits, also
known as PDC's,
which presented an economic hardship.
The plan was revised
to meet
the affordable housing units. I'm sorry.
The plan was revised to meet the
Pinelands Commission standards and
provided 218 market rate units with
eight affordable housing units for a
total of 226 units under the RG3 zone.
The Pinelands
Commission then raised concerns
about the need for clustering in order
to save trees.
[clears throat]
The
commission, I'm sorry, the plan was then
subsequently redesigned
to provide for clustering. Planner
Paulina explained that the residential
portion of the plan has been revised. I
think I've used revised at least twice
if not three times.
Been revised to reduce the number of
buildings to nine including the same 226
units, eight of which will be affordable
housing units.
Each building will be three stories
high. So, I'm going to start with the
fact that it wasn't in 2023 that was
spoken tonight. This started back on
September 1st, 2022 and had three zoning
redeterminations from the housing, I'm
sorry, from the commercial
business to an RG4 and then to an RG3.
So, that means that with all due
respect, we're all in business to make
money. That would mean that Palestinians
associates had to go to the finance
commission. If anybody wants to stop me
at any time, please do. Had to go to the
Pelance Commission three times in order
to get that property where it needs to
be today in order for it to be
considered redevelopment that would meet
the zoning requirements. It's wrong.
It shouldn't be happening. It was zone
highway commercial. Then we tried to
make it RG4, which didn't work out. And
then we turned around and tried to make
it RG3.
We talk about transparency.
It's not happening. It's not happening.
I request that this project be pulled
from the December 17th meeting. I
request that the information that I just
provided be part of the documentation
that you use for consideration of the
vote that evening. And I also would
appreciate it that you would take into
consideration whatever these fine people
have to say from Anchorage Point on
December December 17th. I will be here
that night and I expect to see on the
agenda online my
documentation from the minutes of the
special meeting that I think mayor you
told me that you don't have that often.
Uh at 3:00 on that date in September. I
thank you all very much and wish you all
a very nice Thanksgiving.
If anyone else want to address
government down,
I'm a resident of Anchorage Point. I
spoke here a few months ago. Uh [snorts]
I also retired there. I lived in Upper
Township for 20 years. Moved in
Anchorage Point. Bought a lot in 2019.
Built uh very happy. a dream place.
What's going on now,
the feeling that we have, the
perceptions that we have is this is
getting rammed down our throats. And I
would I would bet that if one or more of
you were my neighbors at Anchorage
Point, this wouldn't be happening. What
I would like to do is sometime before
December 17th, I don't know, I know
Bob's been at Anchorage Point as the
engineer. I don't know if the rest of
you have been there recently. I would
love for you to come before December
17th and meet with some of us. We will
give you a tour. We will show you
firsthand what our concerns are because
this is not good for us. It's the only
person it's good for is a developer. It
is not an area in need of redevelopment.
If you need that, look at those the flea
bag hotels in West Atlantic City. That's
an area in need of redevelopment.
actually already is an area of re it
already is declared that
>> right that is an area of redevelopment.
You can't compare that to Anchorage
Point. Uh
right now it's most of our dream
neighborhood where we I worked hard for
30 years well more than that and
retired. Uh this is what I wanted to do.
Peace and quiet. Um
I hope some of you accept my invitation
and meet with me and others there. We
will take you around. will show you
firsthand.
>> I'm at 28 point drive.
>> I'm not on O'Burn. I'm right around the
corner. It's going to affect us. It's
going to affect all of us.
>> Mhm.
>> Uh
I can give you my number. I'd rather not
read it.
>> Not on the record.
>> Yeah. [clears throat] On that.
>> And that's why we don't even want
addresses truthfully.
>> Okay.
>> Because you know.
>> All right.
>> There's people.
>> Uh let me know if any of you want to
come out before December 17th. I'd love
to give you a tour. Several of my
neighbors would
>> be adversarial.
>> Write your number on this.
>> Okay.
>> So, we'll have it. Actually,
>> make sure it's not on the camera.
[laughter]
>> Are you cooking? [laughter]
>> [laughter]
>> That's what I had to say. We This thing
is getting rammed down our throats. It's
not beneficial to us. It's not
beneficial to the township. It's
beneficial to one party and that's not
fair to us. We're the residents there.
We're the EHT residents. Please take
that into consideration.
>> Okay.
>> And here we are. Take some time and come
out.
>> I'm probably more familiar with
Anchorage Point than I want to commit
to. I've been out there for 15 years. We
were always out on Anchorage Point for
various things and I'll be out to take a
look. I've been out there recently, too.
So, since 2019, I think there's
maybe twice. Well, not taking over, but
in the old days when I was a police
officer, Summers Point answered a lot of
calls out there because of the proximity
of the development and and our fire
apparatus was there all the time when
there was an issue.
>> While I'm here on a different topic,
about a year and a half ago, I had a
serious medical emergency and my wife
called 911,
got patched through the EHT,
and
it took 40 minutes. They had to respond
from Fire Road all the way there. It
took a long time. I got to the hospital.
The doctors told me if it had been a
half hour later. I wouldn't be standing
here. Uh that's something that's a
separate issue, but you know, maybe we
can set up a deal with Summers Point,
they would have been there in 5 minutes.
It's we're an outlier. I know.
>> Here's a problem. We do
>> We do points EMS. Wait, we just made it
because the proximity came from far rude
because it was not in some point but
yeah I don't took a long time another
issue
>> but had a happy ending I'm here so
here
>> all right thank you I hope I hear from
some of you before this December 17th
>> thank you thank you is there anyone else
who would like to address governing body
sing seeing none Pretty
[clears throat]
[laughter]
good.
>> He's got the picture with the baby.
>> With the baby.
>> Yeah.
>> Anyone else?
>> If there's nobody else in public, I I
feel the need to apologize. Not my
colleagues, the folks that are here. The
young lady that was speaking um is
absolutely correct. I've injected myself
especially the way that I did.
>> Thank you, Mr. B. [snorts]
>> Can I have a motion to close a public
portion?
>> I make that a motion.
>> I have a second, please.
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> I.
>> Okay,
let's go to town committee reports.
>> Mr. Rosen,
>> no.
>> No.
>> Mr. Wells.
>> Happy Thanksgiving to everybody.
>> That's a good report.
>> Mr. Hodson,
>> happy Thanksgiving. We have a lot to be
thankful for as president Councilman in
this great country we live in. And to
the people from Anchorage Point, we're
listening. We understand it. And we'll
be out to see. We're not going to do
anything that isn't right by you in the
future. That place has been there. I I
was born and raised in service point.
Crabbed out there, clammed out there,
minnowed out there. Okay, we understand
it. And you we will listen to what you
say and evaluate it on what the owner
thinks or wants to do.
>> You too, Mr. Ellis. Well,
happy Thanksgiving. Please everybody be
safe. Also, I would like to give a shout
out to Harvard Township
Food Bank is located in Harvard Township
like some of the workers here just to
recognize them. If you go by there,
especially during the snap season and
every season, like I've said before,
they feed 6,000 families a month. That's
a lot, you know, and don't do it for a
pat on the back. Some get paid, a lot
get volunteers, but we always and I
always want to recognize people who's in
the trenches to care about others. We
were blessed to have things. Some folks
are not as fortunate. That's why we have
to continue to give to continue to make
this community great. The more we give,
the more we help oursel and help each
other, the better the community will
get. Have a thanks, happy Thanksgiving
and be safe. [laughter]
>> I think and I think I want to say the
same thing. Happy Thanksgiving to
everybody. Uh we had uh just real quick
a football team that didn't quite
>> go ahead. So this is Mr. Ellison's
[laughter]
>> Well, I'm going let you do it. You was
at the parade.
>> I was Yeah, they they're doing great.
Um, this is the second year in a row
they won the championship in the junior
football and we're going to host the
eighth grade bowl. Back in the day, they
used to have the um Allstar game at the
end of the season and the top players
would get to play. All the players that
was on the team was leaving that year uh
that wasn't picked, the season was over.
So, what we did is they changed the
league changed it to a eighth grade bowl
instead of allar bowl. So all the eighth
graders get to play their last game and
that's going to be so special next week
and they're using our practice fields.
They they practicing here teams from all
over the county. So that's going to be a
great thing next week.
>> Very good.
>> Tom.
>> Yes. My can I make a couple
clarifications? So the 2023 date
regarding Timber Rich that I was
referring to was July 17, 2023 when the
planning board gave the redeveloper
would receive a preliminary and final
major site plan approval and minor
subdivision approval from the plant. So
I used that date in my report.
Second, although he left, we do have a
substation and an ambulance station in
summers between now.
>> We've had one for for a while part of
the year. So
>> and and they're doing it. Our animals is
down there in their substation and
they're inside a single bank property
across the
>> Yes. And that's our agreement we have
with
>> but look our assets are used all the
time. So there's a chance that it was
coming from fire road.
>> Actually they weren't even there back
then. So right
>> but now we're working always working to
improve it.
>> Y happy Thanksgiving
>> Mr. Freriedman. Last opportunity to make
a plug for the uh turkey trot 12th 12th
annual turkey trot. There'll be sign up
at 8:00 a.m. for a 9:00 race at the uh
fabulous egg nature reserve. We have
over 110 people that have registered so
far. We expect another 50 to be there
between now and and the uh the race. So
we invite all you runners to come on
out. If you don't want to run and you
want to walk, we have a onem fun walk as
well. And uh it's a great time to get
out and enjoy nature. Hope to see you
Saturday.
>> Can I come on one of those ebikes?
>> No motorized vehicles permitted.
>> Oh, okay.
>> That's a treasure.
>> It really is. All right,
>> Tom. Do we have need for a close session
this evening?
>> Yes, ma'am. I've let you off the hook,
too, in my rows and you're not too late.
[laughter]
>> That'll be brief. Resolution 556
authorizing the township committee to
convene into close executive session to
discuss matters which may involve
personnel and or legal matters. Whereas
the open public meetings act per limits
the exclusion of the public from meeting
in certain circumstances and whereas
this public body is of the opinion that
such circumstances presently exist.
Whereas the governing body wishes to
discuss matters involving personnel
under legal matters as follows. two
legal matters. The Garden State Outdoor
LLC appeal update one year anticipated
disclosure and a Signis lease update
anticipated disclosure of one year.
Whereas
the matter involving the confidentiality
of the above no longer requires that
[music] confidentiality, then the
minutes can be made public. Now
therefore, be it resolved by the
Township Committee, Township of Harbor,
County of Atlantic, New Jersey, that the
public be excluded from this meeting.
>> Thank you. Can I have a motion to go
into pause, please?
>> You too, Ed.
>> Happy Thanksgiving. A motion.
>> Have a second, please. All in favor? Um,
we have to We have to do a roll. Roll
call, please.
>> Yes.
>> Rosenberg, yes.
>> Yes.