Margate City, NJ Planning Board Meeting of January 29, 2026

Yep. All right. Um, we're going to get
going. We're going to do a flag salute.
>> I pledge algiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the
republic for which it stands, one nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all. [laughter]
>> [clears throat]
>> Roll call.
>> Michael Richmond
>> here.
>> Michael Richmond
>> here.
>> Rich Patterson
>> here.
>> John Pittz
>> here.
>> Dan Adams
>> here.
>> Craig Palmisano.
>> Rich Tulsen
>> here.
>> Johanna Perski
>> here.
>> Herb Pagno
>> here.
>> Steve Joki
>> here.
>> Drew Campbell
>> here. Sam Freriedman
>> here.
>> Patty Rosenberg.
>> Okay.
This meeting is being held in accordance
with the New Jersey Open Public Meetings
Act. Notice has been advertised in the
press and posted in the municipal
building and on the city's website.
Applicants are advised that if your
application is approved this evening,
please come forward at the conclusion of
your case and approach the board
administrator PAMA to sign a form
outlining the process for obtaining any
required building permits and/or
merkantale licenses.
Members of the public wishing to speak
during any case must wait for the
chairman to open the floor for public
comment. All speakers will be sworn in
by the board solicitor and must state
their name and address for the record.
Okay. And then um
I hear a motion to approve the minutes
of the meeting of January 8th, 2026.
>> I'll make that motion.
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> I. Approval of decisions and resolutions
number three 2026 election of
chairperson and vice chairperson for the
planning board of the city of Morgate
for the calendar year 2026.
>> Do I hear a motion?
>> Motion.
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> Number four, 2026. Appointment of the
administrator and professionals for the
planning board of the city of Margate
for the calendar year 2026. Do I hear a
motion? Move.
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> I.
>> Number five, appointment number five,
2026, appointment of minor subdivision
committee, site plan subcommittee,
ordinance review subcommittee, and the
master plan subcommittee for the
planning board of the city of Morgate
for the calendar year of 2026. Do I hear
a motion?
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> I Okay.
All righty. Um,
our first case is V2 Properties Entity 7
LLC, 206 North Madison Avenue, block
430, lot 504, zone WSD.
Request use variance D variance relief
to allow construction of a two family
dwelling. Status current on taxes,
water, and sewer. Proof of notice
provided. Attorney Avery S. is it Tyler?
Titler.
>> Titler.
>> Thank you, sir. For the record, Avery
Titler here on behalf of the applicant.
As you mentioned, it's the application
of V2 properties entity
is the owner of the property at 206
North Madison Avenue. It's known as lot
504 in block 430. Property is an
oversized interior lot. It measures 50
ft by 125 ft. It's located in the WSD
zone. The applicant's here tonight
seeking a use variance to construct a
new two family residential dwelling on
the property.
>> Avery, I don't want to interrupt you,
but since it's a devariance, the uh
mayor's design is going to recuse
himself. I just want to put that on the
record. He'll sit in the first row. Are
you okay? You're step first row. Okay.
For this one, Dan. Dan's okay. The class
three member is not here. Uh Dan is a
class two member. You're okay. Uh, I
didn't mean to kill your train of
thought. So,
>> that's all right. Appreciate Leo. Uh, as
I was saying, the the applicants here
tonight for use variance and use
variance only. The relief sought for
rooftop deck has been eliminated as is
the roof pitch variance. So, this is a
straight use variance application. Uh,
as I mentioned before, use variance is
required because in this zone, even
though residential uses are permitted,
as you know, they must be above a
commercial use. Your solicitor will
advise you that the standard for
determining whether a use variance is
appropriate, is whether the use will
serve the general welfare because the
site's particularly suited for the
proposed use, which would be the
positive criteria and whether the
variance be granted without substantial
detriment to the public good without
substantially impairing the intent and
purpose of the zone plan or zoning
ordinance, which is the negative
criteria.
The testimony and evidence that we're
about to present tonight will show that
a majority of the block consists of
primarily residential uses. If approved,
the resulting residential use will be in
conformity and continuity with the
residential nature of the block and the
area. The proposed building will provide
a significant aesthetic improvement to
the neighborhood and pro general welfare
by providing a two a new two family
dwelling on the property which already
contains two principal structures, two
residential principal structures on the
lot. Our application will provide a
level of uniformity and maintain the
character of the neighborhood. As a
result, testimony and evidence will
indicate the property is particularly
suited for the proposed use.
The negative criteria will indicate that
there is no substantial detriment to the
public good and many benefits that will
be presented and granting the variance
will not impair the intent and purpose
of the zone plan and zoning ordinance in
light of the fact that residential uses
are permitted in this zone. I understand
Mr. McCarnner wants to go through his
report and then I will have Mr. Beol
provide some testimony. Is that okay,
Mr. Chairman?
>> Yes.
>> Okay, sure. I'll get Mr. McLaren sworn
in. Uh Mr. McLaren, do you swear I
affirm the testimony you'll give
throughout this evening will be the
truth?
>> I do.
>> Okay. Thanks.
>> Thank you board chairman, board members.
Report is based on the application that
Mr. Per just introduced to the board and
uh again my discussion with the
architect this morning was they are
removing the rooftop deck and which
would create the uh eliminate the
minimum roof [snorts] pitch variance. So
the only variance that they need is a D
variance for conditional use where the
commission is that residential use must
be above commercial use in this
particular zone. However, the existing
site hosts two separate single family
homes which is permitted and they were
well under the density. So now they
they're going to build one flood
compliant structure instead of having
two separate non flood compliant
structures in one lot and they're
meeting all the requirements of the zone
except for the technicality of not
having commercial use below. And again
there is no commercial use at the site
today. Just go over a couple items is
the uh lot area is 4,400 ft is the
minimum required. This site offers 6250
square ft. Minimum lot width is 50 feet
and they provide 50 feet. Lot depth is
not a requirement. However, I do want to
point out that the depth is 125 ft. They
meet all the other requirements for
front yard setbacks, sideyard setbacks,
combined sideyard setbacks, rear yard
setback. Building coverage, they're way
under what's permitted to be in the
zone. Uh building height, there are two
stories above parking where they can go
two and a half if they chose to. They're
well under F. And again as I mentioned
that the rooftop deck and it's
considered a rooftop deck because there
is no third floor. That deck is above
any habitable space
and landscape coverage meets all the
requirements. Off street parking meets
all the requirements.
Parking space sizes. They're they're
proposing two separate pools. They both
comply with every uh all the aspects of
the city's ordinance.
And page two are the plans that were
reviewed to generate this report.
No waiverss have been requested. It's
simply a a use variance for not having
commercial below. So I that's all I have
to say this time.
Thank you. Can I Mr. Be told sworn in
project architect and professional
planner?
>> Sure. Mr. Beal, just give us uh your
name and business address for the
record, please. Uh, Andrew Beckl, 599
Shore Road, Summers Point, New Jersey
08244.
>> And please raise your right hand. Do you
swear affirm the testimony you'll give
this evening will be the truth?
>> It is. Yes.
>> And you're an architect and planner in
the state of New Jersey. Yes, sir.
>> You've appeared before this board
numerous times.
>> Uh, Mr. Chairman, we'll accept his
credentials.
>> Yes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Be. Can you provide the
board an overview of the application,
please?
>> Uh, yes. We propose to remove the two
existing uh non- flood complying
structures and create one single
structure that has two units in them. Um
the building will be taller to comply
with flood uh but it will be now
condensed onto lot match all setback
requirements and height requirements.
>> So let's discuss the variance that we
need to accomplish this. It's just a
straight use variance. Is that correct?
>> That is correct.
>> And you heard Mr. McLaren go through the
application. You agree with his
representations?
>> Absolutely. The other thing that's
interesting to note here is if you had a
commercial property underneath this, be
very difficult to have any kind of
parking on site whatsoever because of
the it's 50 ft wide, but you'd still
have to have some kind of car park in
the back of the building in some way
somehow. Um, which would compromise the
the commercial structure. It would be
kind of difficult to have the commercial
structure with all the compliant parking
that would be required.
>> And we've removed the request for a
rooftop deck and therefore that's gone.
So that eliminates variance and then
also our roof pitch is going to be
compliant.
>> Yes, that's actually what these exhibits
are. This is basically the modified
drawings which you already have which
would have been the [clears throat]
elevation sheets and plan sheets and
we've simply removed the rooftop deck
from this and removed the um access to
rooftop which is a non-compliant roof
that is not [clears throat]
>> Leo we probably should mark that in
>> we can call that that's that's your
submission
>> that's exhibit one excuse me exhibit two
and exhibit one was for plans where we
simply removed on the roof plan the roof
top
>> okay perfect thank you so variance
that's being sought
use variance. Correct.
>> That is correct.
>> All right. And we've said this, Mr.
McCarn said this. Residential uses are
permitted in the zone. However, it needs
to be above a commercial use. Is that
correct?
>> That is correct.
>> All right. Can you provide the board uh
just some color regarding the
surrounding block statistics?
>> The entire block is pretty much
residential. Um there's a parking lot
directly behind us that Steve Oh, it's
across the street from Stephven Cookies
restaurant. Uh, but basically everything
around this is elevated multif family
structures of some kind. Duplexes,
single, well a few singles, but mostly
duplex.
>> That was my other question. There's
there's other two family residential
dwellings on this block.
>> Yes. Yes. But really no commercial.
[snorts]
>> So it would be your testimony. It's
predominantly a residential area.
>> Yes, this block is predominantly
residential with the exception of the
parking lot behind. So based upon the
fact that uh it's predominantly a
residential area and it the lot actually
has two residential uses on it. Would
you agree that the property is
particularly suited for what we're
proposing here tonight?
>> Absolutely. Yes.
>> All right. And you've designed this
building in such a fashion that it's
below the maximum threshold for many
bulk criteria.
>> Yes.
>> Let's go through some of them. Front
yard setbacks less than what could be
required or less?
>> It's greater than it's greater than what
is required. Yes.
>> Yes. Same thing with the rear yard
setback.
>> Correct. Yes.
>> Building coverage is less than the
maximum.
>> Yes. It is less than maximum.
>> Flurry ratio. Yes.
>> All right. Anything else I'm missing
>> combined? And you said sides. So, yes.
All
>> And then also I think there was a total
story too. I think we could have another
half story.
>> Could have another half story, but again
with the height that we had uh even with
where the floor is supposed to be, we
really could accommodate the half story
and we didn't think it was prudent.
There weren't many other halfstory
structures in the area.
>> Okay. So, will the construction of this
two family dwelling preserve the present
character of the neighborhood as being
residential? Oh,
>> we believe so. Yes. And you you feel
from a planning standpoint this would be
a benefit to the public good?
>> Yes.
>> All right. We talk about the public
good. We're talking about surrounding
property
>> owners and neighbors.
>> It's it's it's cohesive with the rest of
the neighborhood in the area. That's
primarily multif family homes.
>> All right. So in your professional
opinion the positive criteria satisfied
to the use of errands may be granted.
>> Yes. And let's talk about some of the um
purpose of municipal land use law that
are being advanced which would uh
qualifies for special reasons. We're
preserving the residential character of
the neighborhood which you just
mentioned. Correct.
>> Yes.
>> The bulk standards are well below the
maximum.
>> Yes.
>> All right. You're removing a
non-conforming two non-conforming
structures on the property that are
non-conforming for bulk criteria. Is
that correct?
>> All criteria and flood criteria which is
important. and [clears throat]
um non-conforming use having two
principal structures in one line.
>> Again, as McLaren said, you can kind of
have that. So again, you know, we're
we're certainly removing [snorts] the
two that were on there, which I'm sure
would cause some
logistical issues as far as like how who
owns what and how it's owned
>> and the aesthetics. It's it's a much
better aesthetically looking.
>> Again, we believe we've improved the
desirable visual environment and also
getting out of flood I think is very
important.
>> Okay. Can you think of a substantial
detriment to the public good by granting
the application? No. Again, this is
primarily two family homes in this
block. There's really no commercial
corridor in this area.
>> That goes to my next question. As far as
will there be a substantial impairment
to the intent purpose of the zone plan
zoning ordinance?
>> I see none. Again, this this area is
primarily residential
>> and residential uses are permitted in
this zone which which even in further
advances your answer. Would that be
correct?
>> Yes.
>> Those are all the questions I have for
Mr. Be the applicant rest for the
moment.
do want to add a couple things, a couple
comments to that.
>> In the WSD, as in the CBD and C1 and C2,
if you're going to add the residential
element to it, single family homes, you
have to abide by the multif family
standards, which they do. And actually,
the zoning border is on the south side
of that property. So, that's why it
reflects mainly multif family in that
area because it is you step over 5t,
you're in a multif family zone. So I
just want to point out that the criteria
used was a MF zone criteria and that was
required and uh [clears throat] that's
what they did. So
>> yeah,
>> anybody from the board
questions or comments?
>> Uh yeah, I have a question.
>> Um I looked over your prince. What kind
of storage space do you have for things
like bicycles, surfboards, beach chairs?
The garage is actually wider than the
parking spaces. So, we'll have room
along the side of the garage. Uh there
also, especially when you see around the
elevator, the the right hand side, the
west side of the garage. And then
actually side of the garage. Again, you
have the wide section along the sides.
Remember, most nobody's really driving a
9 by 18 bar. So, you're going to have a
lot of space with these vehicles and
they're incredibly long spaces. Nobody.
You're going to unless you're driving an
extended cab truck, you're pretty much
going to have lots and lots.
>> Well, that's a concern because, you
know, a lot of times people are not
using their car garages for cars
[snorts] here. Have to store all their
stuff in it. Understood. But again,
there's significant lift in these
garages. The garage are approximately 16
ft wide and the car is only it's only 9
ft. So, you're going to have 7 ft of
space on each side.
Well, on either side in total, you have
>> supposed to be good at math. Andrew.
>> Okay. Anyone else from the board?
Anyone from the public like to speak?
Okay. Public portion's closed.
Unless the [clears throat] board has
anything and and Mr. Tyler wants to sum
up, um, we can we can go move this to a
vote.
>> I think it's a very straightforward
application. Um, I think the testimony
evidence indicates the property is
particularly suited for the proposed
use. As it is now, the property contains
two residential uses. What we're trying
to do is take two uh non-conforming
structures, put it into a conforming
structure that's more aesthetically
pleasing out of the flood plane and uh
just do something very nice for the
area. So for those reasons, I think the
board has enough testimony and evidence
to grant the application. Thank you.
>> All right. Um this is a se seven members
will vote on this application because it
is a Dvarian. That's the only variance
that's required. It requires five out of
seven a super majority to pass. Um use
variance standard is you can you have to
set forth positive reasons which the
applicant went through as far as the the
purposes of zoning that are advanced.
And then there's a an element of site
suitability. Is this property
particularly well suited for the
proposed uh two family use? And then the
negative criteria as with every every
other application is is there
substantial detriment to the public good
or substantial substantial detriment to
the zone plan or zoning ordinance. So
unless there's any other questions, it's
just for use variance approval. And
we'll need a motion, a second, and a
roll call vote.
Second.
>> Okay.
>> Michael Richmond.
>> Yeah. I I really think it's much better
for the neighborhood to make this a
residential commercial. Like you said, I
don't know where people would park. I'm
I'm actually kind of surprised and
shocked that this area was in that zone.
I'm sure we're going to have a a a
master plan review in a a year or so and
I think that's one of the first things
we'll change. So I I I definitely think
it's good for the neighborhood and the
city and I'm going to approve it.
>> Rich Patterson.
>> Uh I also approve it's it's what they're
doing is is the most suitable thing for
the area. So I approve.
>> Dan Adams.
>> Yeah, I'm going to echo their comments.
um in looking at what is in the area
already and what you're building, it it
really fits the area and really goes
with it. And you're taking two
non-conforming and non, you know, uh
floodprone home or I should say
floodprone homes and making this
elevated and making it uh a much safer
and better structure. For that matter, I
will approve. Thank you,
>> Rich Tullson.
for all the a
wrong word
counselor help me out I'm hanging
>> a forementioned
>> affformentioned thank you um statements
that have made I go along with this um
but in addition I want to add that there
were two variances that may have been
requested of the original plan that have
been adjusted um and for [clears throat]
that I vote in favor that was the easy
>> Johanna Perski
>> uh I agree with uh a comment. [snorts] I
was also surprised that this would
actually be that this was a mixed use
and I think this is a much better fit
for women
>> heragna.
>> I'll agree with the other members. Nice
enhancement to the neighborhood.
[snorts]
>> Drew Campbell
>> with everybody else.
[clears throat] Win-win
>> for the city, for the neighborhood, and
uh for the flood insurance companies.
So, uh I approve.
>> Thank you very much.
>> Motion carries. Seven in favor and zero
opposed.
>> Okay. Our next case is Charles and
Ireina Erlic. Eric, 106 North Argyle
Avenue, block 302.01, 01 lot 17 zone S25
request C variance relief for front yard
setback to extend the front porch and
add a porch roof status current on taxes
and silver proof of notice provided the
attorneys Christopher Balson
>> I'm going to go first I'll let him get
settled
Okay.
>> Okay.
[snorts]
>> Thank you, board chairman, board
members. This is a report based on the
application of Charles and Ireina Erlick
at 106 North Avenue, block 302.01,
lot 17 located in S25 zoning district.
Uh CC variance is planning and zoning
report. This is not a hardship variance,
but it's a substantial benefit variance.
So they do want to they have an existing
front porch with an awning. They
basically want to replace the canvas
awning with a hard roof. So this
generates two report uh two variances
on section page two on my report
highlighted are the two variances and on
page three the variances listed are
incorrect. Uh that's when I must have
gotten three phone calls but uh
front yard setback to the port truth
whereas the minimum required front yard
setback is 10 ft. One foot exists and 0
foot 0t is proposed. [clears throat]
Also in in tangent with that is the
[snorts] sideyard setback to the porch
on the right side. Uh 8 ft's required
4.3 ft exists and 4.3 ft is is proposed.
They are the two variances. Again, it's
an existing non-conforming lot. Typical
with these older homes, especially in
this area where the lot coverage is way
over, the building coverage is way over.
It's a lot of house and a small lot, but
that's not why they're here. They're
here for the front yard porch and the
roof. So, that concludes my report at
this time.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the
board. My name is Chris Ellen. I
represent [snorts]
Irma Erl and your husband
>> Charles. and husband Charles with
protecting their property 106 North
Argal Avenue. It's a nice little Cape
Cod one and a half story. Um what the
Elix would like to do simply is to bring
their porch more toward the side of the
house by about 2 ft but leaving leaving
I think a couple feet. So it'll be a
setback of 4.3 still
and bring and and install a roof bring
that down as well. Um the issue that
Roger brings up is with respect to the
roof being coming to the property line
and the drainage. All I can say is
there's about a 3-ft bed there that
extends across the front of the house
before you get to the sidewalk where
that can drain to. And it's and that
condition replicates itself on each side
of this house. So it's it's consistent
with with the house with the houses on
both sides. So the variances, as Roger
pointed out, is for the sideyard setback
for the porch and the roof and the front
yard set back for the porch of the roof.
Um John Barnhart did the plan testify
with respect to the variances.
>> All right, Mr. Barnhart, just your name
and business [clears throat] address,
please.
>> John Barnhard, uh, 400 North Avenue.
[clears throat]
>> Okay. Please raise your right hand. You
swear affirm the testimony you'll give
this evening will be the truth.
>> I do.
>> Engineer and planner in the state of New
Jersey. Correct. We'll accept his
credentials.
>> Thank you,
>> John. You prepared the plan that's been
submitted to the board for their
consideration?
>> Yes, we did.
>> And um spoke with the earlings and
understand what they wanted to do and
what you've accomplished with that plan
and what's proposed.
>> Yeah, that's correct.
>> Tell the board what's going on.
>> Sure. So, obviously, as Chris has
described already, it's a it's a pretty
simple application um that we think fits
in really very well with the
neighborhood and and most specifically
the properties on either side of this
house. Um so, the Elix property um it is
a conforming lot for the district. They
have a uh it's a one and a half story
very modest uh size house with regard to
its uh appearance from the street. Um,
and they have a an existing an existing
porch along the front that's 1 foot from
the front property line as it exists
today. And it has a an an awning, a
retractable canopy that goes over top of
that uh that existing porch. Um, over
the years they they've struggled to
maintain the maintain the canopy, the
awning. Um, it's just become, you know,
it's become something that they they
they would like to make the property
more [snorts] aesthetically pleasing
with a hard roof structure. um and also
have it um be more realistically used um
as compared to a retractable awning. So,
and if you look at the layout of their
of their lot and their and their
existing building, this front porch
really is their only outdoor living
space uh that's meaningful in any way.
So, what they what they're proposing to
do um is to reconstruct the porch. Um
they are they are far as expanded
slightly. Um I'll say to the north um we
still have a 4.3 foot step bracket which
is two feet clear of the existing
sidewall at home at 2.3 ft. Um and then
the um the hard roof structure would
would cover that porch. Um, and we did a
schematic uh you can see here that would
come off of the existing roof uh and
[snorts] cover that porch area and just
have a slight uh 12 inch overhang just
from an aesthetic perspective as
compared to where the columns for the
porch would sit. Um, so the porch itself
in position will match the 1t that
exists today. Um, the overhang would
project another 12 in or so will be at
the property line.
>> And John, we've talked about the fact
that there's a one foot setback. porch
pulling it back. But when you factor in
the the columns at the edge of the porch
edge of the porch, you just have to cut
the roof off right there. Aesthetically
that would look
>> you could cut the roof off right there,
but aesthetically I think it would look
you [clears throat] have to move the
columns back and you'd be reducing the
depth of the porch. And as I said, um
it's really the only the only meaningful
exterior living space that they have
>> from a functional purpose and a
usability point. That's better design.
>> Correct. Correct. So this is a case of
you know obviously if this was brand new
construction we would not even be
considering an application like this. Um
we would be meeting meeting minimum
setbacks try but if you look at the
setbacks on either side of this property
and how those properties are developed
and really if you go down the block this
is a block that has a lot of very very
very very small frontier setbacks. um
property to the north uh as you visit
the site, a two and a half story
structure. You can see here in in our
survey that we picked up the stairs and
and the porch of that structure um which
is nearly in line with with our porch
now. Maybe it's maybe it's another six
back further. What the survey doesn't
show if you were to visit this house is
that when you get beyond this porch,
there's actually two stories of hard
building uh within that same plane
>> on the on the line. Same on the same
line.
>> That's correct. That's correct. When you
go to the what I'm going to call to the
south or plan south, you see that the
line of that building next to us is is
nearly identical. However, what you're
not seeing is that there's actually a
porch off of that house with almost the
identical roof that we are proposing
over that porch. So, if you did visit
the site, you and you were standing in
front of standing in front of our house
and you look to your left, that shed
roof that is on that porch is very
similar and and frankly what gave our
client the idea to be able to do it. Um,
I think it'll create a really nice nice
aesthetic appeal. Um, and really has no
negative impact to this neighborhood.
>> One of the things what the thing that
makes this work at this location is the
the rightway that's available between
the edge of sidewalk and the house.
>> Yeah. So, the way this the way this site
exists, as Chris already mentioned,
there's about a three-foot landscape
area in front of the porch. Although if
you went there today, you didn't see it
because of the snow. But um there is
actually a perceived area of land
between the back of sidewalk and the
front of the porch um that looks like
it's part of the lot.
>> It's not perceived. It is it is land.
It's there.
>> Correct. So, and as Chris mentioned,
although we are requesting to go to the
property line with the uh with the roof
overhang, um the plan would be to have
um downspouts at the corners of the new
roof that would basically go right down
into that landscape area and would
actually help support the landscaping
because it's a small area, but um it
would direct rain water into that area
to help support the landscaping.
>> And that's the only landscaping that
would that serves the property, so to
speak.
>> It it does. That's correct. um with
respect to the variance and
justification under the positive
criteria in the land use act. Do you
think that the plan um addresses any of
those purposes?
>> Yeah. So I think that this that this
application may uh creates a uh a more
aesthetic or envir or positive visual
environment um by being creative uh with
what they have to work with. Um there's
not a lot of opportunity to make a lot
of changes on this on this property
because of how the house sits. Um
there's not a lot of space on this lot.
Um, but it will create it will create an
aesthetic that really goes with the
neighborhood and then obviously serves a
function for our client.
>> Do you think the variance can be granted
without substantial det without
substantially impairing the intent
purpose of the zone plan zoning
ordinance? Yes, with regard to the zone
flare zoning ordinance, as I mentioned,
if this was new construction, we
certainly wouldn't be looking at an
application like this, but um keeping a
modestly sized home on this block,
trying to make it better, trying to make
it nicer, trying to make it useful for
the people that live within it and doing
it in a manner that matches or or very
nearly matches what our neighbors have
on either side. And if you go down the
block further, as I mentioned in the
beginning of my testimonial, there's
many homes that are very close to the
property line uh on Avenue. So, this is
very consistent with the development
pattern. Um, so for those reasons, we do
not believe there's a substantial
detriment for the public good. Uh, nor
is there a substantial detriment to the
zone.
>> What's the uh length of the forge
extension? Just a couple feet.
>> Um, it's about
>> Yeah, maybe.
>> That's all I have, John. Thank you.
That's all I have. Thank you.
[clears throat]
>> Okay. Anyone from the board?
>> Nope. Anyone from the public?
Um
so okay the uh awning that's existing
>> track
>> right so what is what's the issue with
that awning
>> what's the issue with that
>> wind and it's not wind and sun the wind
it's not very sturdy and the sun
protection is marginal
>> functionally it doesn't it doesn't serve
its purpose
>> okay
Um,
so I don't see any type of I guess I
guess you could pick it up from the um I
didn't see a front elevation of what the
um roof's going to look like.
>> Exactly like next door.
>> Huh?
>> Exactly like next door. I have a picture
of it. The same same roof as next door.
>> So they have that next door.
>> Exact same thing.
>> Okay.
>> 104. That's the same exact
>> do they? Y
>> Okay. I I looked I saw the house on the
north side where the steps stick out and
all that stuff. I didn't see.
>> Okay. Um,
all right. I don't have anything else.
>> Okay.
>> All right. If there's no other questions
there, it's a C, this is a C variance
application.
>> I think we opened and closed, right?
>> Um, it's a C variance variance
application. There's two variances. It's
the front yard setback to the to the
porch which is now going to be covered.
Comes to the property line zero. So 0
feet or 10 ft required. And then the
sideyard set back to the porch to the to
the porch edge or roof on the right
side. 8 ft required and 4.3 ft is
proposed. In terms of conditions, just
our normal standard ones. Anything in
Mr. McCclar's report? Any
representations the applicant will
comply with subject to any outside
approvals? Just the standard ones.
>> I'll make that motion. second.
>> Mike Richmond.
>> Um, actually seeing the picture of the
next door neighbor's roof, um, I think
that, um, it I don't see any I think it
look would look better than doing a the
retractable awning or even a canvas
awning. Um, they don't it's not a big
house. They don't have like a lot of
outdoor living space. It's not, you
know, like Roger said, it's not their
fault that the house was built in 1942
and, you know, they they did things
differently then. So, I don't see an
issue with it. I want to approve it.
>> Rich Patterson.
>> Yeah. I was concerned about going to the
property line and being on the public
right away until I went and visited the
site today and saw if there's any
runoff, it's dripping right into the
bushes, which is a good thing. Uh, so I
don't see any detriment. I think it's an
improvement to the neighborhood. I
approve.
>> Dan Adams.
>> Yeah. You know, my only first part when
it said that it was getting extended,
but it's only going 3 ft and it's on
that side and it doesn't go beyond the
house and still gives plenty of area.
Um, I agree. Looking at the structure
next door and looking at this, it'll be
an improvement to the home. It'll make
the neighborhood look more aesthetically
pleasing. And for that matter, I I find
no objection to it. I vote yes.
>> Rich Tollson.
>> I vote in favor.
>> Johanna Perski.
>> Um I think it's an enhancement to the
house and it's a very nice street and I
think it will definitely continue to add
to the character as well. I approve
>> heragno.
I agree with the other members to make
it your outdoor space more permanent be
a nice addition.
>> Drew Campbell.
[clears throat]
>> I agree with the fellow board members.
>> Steve Joki.
>> Uh yeah, I agree also. I believe it's an
improvement to the neighborhood and um I
like the idea that you're going to
overhang it is it is it is aesthetically
pleasing. So I I approve
>> John Pittz.
>> Um in my opinion granting the variance
negatively impacts light air and open
space in an area where it's already
sorely lacking. Uh I think the variance
um benefits only the homeowner and I
vote no.
Motion carries with eight in favor and
one opposed.
>> Thank you very much.
>> You're welcome.
>> Our next case is Samuel and Jamie Adler,
3 North Franklin Avenue, block 207.01,
01 lock 4 zone S25
requesting a C variance relief for
sideyard setbacks and building coverage
to allow construction of a new single
family home. Current on taxes, water and
sewer proof of notice provided the
attorneys Christopher Balance.
>> Thank you board chairman, board members.
The report is based on the application
Samuel and Jamie Adler 3 North Franklin
Avenue block 207.01
01 lot 4 located in S25 zoning district
so you can see variances uh planning
zoning report minimum first floor
elevation is uh 13 ft or if they put
parking below they're now 30 ft above 9
ft team complete
substantial benefit variance background
is as follows the applicant is seeking
relief to cons uh construct a new flood
compliant single family structure within
the S25 single family zoning district
lot width is 35 ft wide whereas 40 ft is
required minimum so it's an existing
non-conforming condition combined side
setbacks are not being met therefore a
variance is required for that as well
also the building coverage exceeds what
it permitted even though smaller lots
already get a higher percentage
allowance
a survey is required that survey has
been submitted and approved
page two of the report is the zoning
chart lot minimum lot error for S25 5 is
2500 ft. They're just shy at 2300 62.5
ft. Minimum lot width is 40 ft. They're
at 35 ft. Lot depth is not required, but
the they do provide 67 1/2 ft, which is
typical of that area. Also, the 35 foot
lot width is typical this whole area as
well.
So again, there's three variances
identified in the report. One is the
combined sideyard setbacks. They need
12.95 ft. They're 11 feet. Building
coverage required is a maximum of 40%
which is 945 ft. They're asking for 45%
which is uh 1,62.69
ft.
And the third one is the fireplace
projection and the setback. Populace
projections are not allowed in the
sideyard setback unless it's a minimum
of 7 ft and they only have six feet. So
that's a varance as well.
>> It's gone.
>> Fireplace
all the way down.
>> But the fireplace is not projected out.
>> It's gone. Okay.
>> Off the plan.
>> That's good.
So that's pretty much it.
>> Board members. Thank you. Chris Bson for
the Adlers who are here.
Um the property is at 3 North Franklin
Avenue. It's the it's block 207.01 lot
4. It's 35 ft lot uh in a in a zone that
requires 40 ft of furniture. It's in the
S25 zone. And the um others bought this
house which you see has since been
demolished because it was mold ridden
and dilapidated and the systems were
non-compliant. It was non-food compliant
and um it was an Airbnb routinely and
when these guys looked at it they bought
it but they took it down right away for
fear that something somebody get hurt
just a crappy little house that's what
it was. So, it it that came down and now
they're proposed to build a brand new
two-story home, two stories over
parking. Uh, two and a half are
permitted, but not over parking. They're
going to stay at two stories, about
2,000 ft total. Um, the variances that
are being requested and the
[clears throat] plan is modified
slightly. You'll see that instead of six
and five on the lefth hand side, it's
going to be six all the way down, five
on the right in the parking lot side.
So, it's 11 ft where where 12.95 is
required. So it's about about 1.9 ft
total sideyard. Both both sideyards meet
the minimum sideyard requirement. In
fact, the left sideard exceeds it at
six.
Um by compressing the house to try and
do as best you can with the sideyard,
the footprint expands. That's where the
additional coverage comes in. Um we
don't think that's exorbitant. We think
in exchange for the twostory design that
five additional 5% of coverage is
helpful to to have a a house that is
small but up to today's standards in
terms of have a livable space and and
circulation things of that nature. Um as
Roger said it really only takes you from
about 980 ft to a little over 1,000
square feet per floor. Um but as Scott
will tell you the architect it is the
designer. Um it makes a difference in
the house. Uh Scott Narring is the
designer and drafts person uh for the
project out of Jack's office. Sorry.
>> Uh Holiday Architect.
>> Holiday Architects. Uh this gentleman,
what's your name?
>> Jason P.
>> Jason is a licensed architect. These
guys work together. Scott's been there
for 30 plus years. He's a partner in the
firm and uh drafted the plan and
designed the project.
>> Scott, introduce yourself and do do give
the board the benefit of your your
background experience.
>> Sure. My name is Scott Nering. Um I run
the team. We're just going to get you
sworn in real quick. It's Scott Naring.
How do you spell that?
>> N H R I N G.
>> You want want to have um just Jason? Is
it Jason?
>> Um as well just to just for the record.
>> Yeah, sure.
Jason
Patchel P A T C H E L
>> P A T C H E L. And you're with Holiday
Architects in Ocean City? Holiday
Architect in
>> How about that?
>> Yeah. Um where's Holiday Arc? Just
what's your business address?
>> Uh so Brigant, we have two offices. One
in Medford, New Jersey. Uh that's 30
Jackson Road in Medford.
>> I have an office in Brigantine, which is
3212 Atlantic Brigantine Boulevard.
>> Okay. And if the two of you can each
raise your right hand, each swear the
testimony you'll give this evening will
be the truth.
>> Yes. Yes.
>> And Mr. Pel, you're a licensed architect
and and and Mr. Naring, you're more of a
drafts person. Is that am I saying that
correct?
>> A partner in the firm. Uh I have 35
years experience. Um I I testified in
front of Brigantine probably half a
dozen times in the past year uh and many
other boards in the South Troy area.
>> And you were responsible for designing
this house for the
>> That's correct.
>> Under the under the control under the
opices of of the architect.
>> Gotcha. um accept this qualification
simply as a desire or as a drafts
person, not as an architect, not as a
licensed architect, planner or engineer.
>> Right. But you're
>> this gentleman is is here for backup
architectural lure if we need it.
>> Right.
>> But Scott really know Scott knows the
plan,
>> right? Okay. So, you're a licensed
architect,
>> correct? I'm a licensed architect. Good
>> accept.
>> Yeah, absolutely.
>> Thanks,
>> Scott. Um you heard my introduction. Um
tell me start start with the when the
Adlers came to you told you what they
had told you about the lot um and what
you ended up designing and the variances
that were asked with.
>> Sure. So uh actually when the Adlers
came to me they already had a house
designed on the lot that's much larger.
Um so we've since [clears throat] shrank
the house
>> working with their lawyers who the house
downsized. Yeah, we had to we downsized
it considerably from the original plan
that they had designed. Uh we took over
the plan and thought we came up with a
very good design that fit fit the
neighborhood, didn't overbuild on the
lot. Um
>> what is the design from?
>> So the design well if you don't mind
>> uh well I'll go into the new house. So
the new house is about 272 square ft. Uh
it's flood compliant. It's going to be
built above a garage, two stories above
the garage. Um,
right now the house is 24 foot wide. We
are going to eliminate the fireplace. So
that alleviates the one variance that
we're requesting. So
>> on the plan it looks as the house
actually bumps out to a 5ft setback for
a portion on that left side that comes
off
>> just at the fireplace.
>> Understood?
>> Yes.
>> But that that comes off from that wall
the left wall all the way down to be a
six foot setback.
>> Yeah. for the majority of it. So the the
the house itself does
uh jog in the back of the house. So the
six foot setback
is probably for the first let's say half
of the house and then it jogs back
another 8 in after that towards the rear
>> jogs back out or in
>> out
>> or in farther. So it's going to give us
6 foot
>> six foot hook
>> at the back of the house. I was going to
say we're going to change that.
[laughter]
>> But yes, the the fireplace is
eliminated. Uh the house itself is 272
square ft. It's four bedrooms, three
baths. Um [clears throat]
max building height is only 27.08
ft as a or below the requirement uh by
about 3 ft.
>> It's over your first floor, right?
>> I'm sorry.
>> Over your first floor. 27 ft over your
first floor.
>> That That's correct. Yes. Um so where 30
foot's allowed so we are not maximizing
the building height. Um again the left
side of the house will have a minimum of
6 ft for the entire length. On the right
side which is the parking lot side we
will have 5 ft. Um so it gives us a
total of sideyard of 11 ft. Um where
12.95 is required. Um front yard um just
to correct the uh front yard setback was
15 ft prevailing. We're providing 15 ft
then 18.5
ft at the parking spot. Um the existing
house did not have the um the parking as
per RSIS.
>> Yeah, it did didn't have any parking,
did it?
>> It did have a driveway, but it was it
was 7 and 1/2 ft.
>> Had no fly parking,
>> right? So, um,
now we are going to have a space in the
front, a space in the garage, which will
be an oversized onecar garage, not a
full twocar garage. [clears throat] Um,
>> and that set back on the left side that
improves from about what was about 2 and
1/2 ft down 6 ft.
>> Yeah. So, on the original house before
it was torn down, it was 2.8 ft off of
that side h of the house. So, now we
will have a minimum of 6 ft along that
side of the house. Uh on the other side
of the house it was 7.93.
Um so we'll be a little bit closer to
the parking lot side on that side
>> but but conforming to the minimum
standard.
>> Correct. We do meet the minimum
standard.
>> So our coverage is about 5% over. Why is
that and why do you think that's
necessary?
>> So typically and I think the intent of
the ordinance with a 40ft lot that's
required in that zone you could build a
25ft house that gives you
>> 25 wide
>> 25 foot wide house. Correct. And that
gives you enough room um for ample or or
not ample but um
>> reasonable what reasonable thank you
reasonable size rooms. Um our house is
24 ft wide. So it kind of gives us the
minimum when you get two bedrooms
alongside of each other. You don't want
to get too small there. So the request
for the larger for the decrease in the
sideyard setbacks um and the increase in
the building coverage is so that we
don't have to go to a 22 foot wide house
on a non-conforming lot.
>> Let's talk about that for a second. What
what you're I think what you're saying
is that if we complied with the required
setbacks,
>> you have a house that's 22 22 ft wide.
>> That's correct.
>> When the zone allows for a house 25 ft
wide,
>> correct?
>> If it were conform. Correct.
>> We But we are we're not going we're not
asking for the full 25. We we're asking
for a house of 24 ft. In your opinion,
from a design standpoint, that's a
reasonable request, a reasonably
reasonably wide house under today's
housing standards?
>> I believe so.
>> Um so again, uh if we had to go to a 22
foot house, it's not really livable when
you look at bedroom sizes less than
they're going to be about 10 10 and 1/2
ft wide. So, it's it's more of a a
livability issue. Um, I think this h
this new house, even though it does have
less of a sideyard does meet the intent.
>> How how big are the bedrooms?
>> The bedrooms are 11 ft wide,
>> including the master bedroom. So, it's
11 ft wide, which is pretty minimum for
if you provide a king bed in there.
Well, when you when you have to compress
the footprint from the width side
tends to get longer and that's where
your coverage gets picked up. Additional
coverage.
>> Yes.
>> That still only gives you bedrooms of 11
by 10 11 x 12.
>> They're they're on the smaller side. Um,
you know, the house will be flood
compliant. Um, which the old house was
not. Um, I think overall it's a it's a
good design. It's a reasonable design
where we're not trying to overbuild on
the lot. I I was It's a better appearing
structure than what was there,
especially when you coming into town and
now you have the open parking lot. This
is the first house you're going to see.
>> That's correct. And there's a very
similar house across the street that
seems newer. Uh it's a full 2 and 1/2
story. It's not over a garage. They are
building on the other corner. It looks
like two stories over retail. Um so I
think as far as height goes, I think
we're we meld within the neighborhood as
well. And you're aware that we um we
have spoken to the neighbor we have
spoken to the neighbor on the left.
She's she's has no problem with the fact
that her setback on that side's gone
from 2 and 1/2 ft to six feet. Um but
she didn't have an objection. And um do
you think there's any detriment from a
design standpoint uh to the
neighborhood?
>> I don't believe so.
>> How about to the zoning ordinance, the
zone plan the fact it's 35t lot?
>> Again, I think we meet the intent. We we
have the minimum sideyards. Uh we don't
meet the the combined total but I I
believe we meet the
>> and the front yard set back at that's 15
feet the principal structure.
>> That's correct.
>> That's fairly significant front yard.
>> Yes. Where the the old house was even
closer.
So the original house was
off the front yard was only 14 ft and
plus then the porch. Um, so I believe
we're we're we're setting it back a
little farther or to to conform with the
uh block standards.
>> That's all we have members of board.
That that sums up the project. If
anybody has any questions, the Adlers
are here. Scott's here. Jason is here.
>> So what what is the total overage on on
the coverage?
>> 5%.
>> Huh?
>> 5%.
>> 4.98 if you want to be exact. Uh it's a
it's
>> What is the square footage? The square
>> 2014 2,140,
>> right? So, and what is
>> So, the overage is about 110 square
feet.
>> 110 square.
>> Yeah. 112.
>> Okay.
>> Roger. How much extra coverage do they
have because it's a smaller lot?
>> 5%.
>> It's S25, right?
>> Well, yeah. It's based on lots that are
less than 30,000 ft. You get 40%. Right.
greater than 3,000. It's a sliding
scale. So 5,000 foot lot, you get 30%.
>> And you said,
>> so 40% is the max. You get 45% in MF
zone. So yeah, you're about 117 square
ft over what you're allowed to do.
[clears throat]
>> If you met this combined sideyard
setbacks, you'd be almost there.
>> If what, Roger, I'm sorry.
>> If you met the combined sideyard
setbacks, you'd be almost at the point.
If we if we shorten the house up, we we
probably make coverage comply as well,
>> right? But then you mean to combine side
setback
22 ft wide, right?
>> Doesn't work. I I could shorten the
house up.
>> You know, we hear these arguments on 25T
lots. I'm just surprised to hear these
arguments on a 35t lot. You know, we
want the smaller lots to have smaller
houses.
>> Understood. I just said I can shorten
the house up and make comply
from front to back. compress it. I would
only ask I'm only asking for the setback
variances in light of
>> I have no problem with that.
>> So that's a condition of the approval.
We will truncate we'll make the house
short shorter uh and bring it in bring
make coverage comply.
>> Yeah. I mean what's the problem with a
setback on the parking lot side? I mean
who cares?
>> So I I don't have any problems fast
forward to the minimum. I just had
>> 22 24 White House is problematic
problem. Um, we'll make coverage comply.
We we'll tweak the house to make
coverage comply.
Right.
>> Yes. Okay.
>> Um, that's all I have.
>> Uh, what's a retreat room?
>> Uh, basically a secondary living area,
TV area
>> cuz this looks like it could be a fifth
bedroom.
>> It does not have a door or a closet on
it.
>> Always put one in. Well, you can always
do a lot of things, but it's meant to be
a secondary living space for the kids.
[laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Anybody else from the board?
>> Steve. Steve.
>> Um, if you're really concerned about
that, we can make the master bedroom
bigger, but I I you're allowed to have
it kind of an allpurpose room,
especially with kids.
>> Yeah, I understand.
>> It could be I mean, it could be a
modified Sure. just trying to avoid a
problem where somebody might want to
>> and you're in a house where no there was
no parking before now now at least you
have to find parking
>> that's that's what I'm saying I I felt
the same thing about the the retreat
room which is a new one but I also agree
that especially with kids you know small
house it's not like you know
>> so I have a little
>> personally I don't have a problem with
keeping as a retriever [clears throat]
>> so so I have a question these these
young adults over here. Would that be
their room?
>> Past that time. I'm sorry.
>> I think it's more intended to be kind of
that TV playroom. My wife works from
home as well.
>> Right. Be in office.
>> Let me let me introduce Sam Adler.
>> All right. Mr. Adler, just state your
name for the record, please.
>> Uh Samuel Adler. Um
>> Okay. And you're the owner of the
property, obviously.
>> Correct.
>> Okay. Please raise your right hand. You
swear affirm the testimony you're about
to give will be the truth.
>> I do. Okay. Thanks,
>> Sam. Mr. Seci asked a question about the
retreat room. What What was that? Who we
didn't you didn't come up with that
name.
>> Um Yeah. So, I didn't come up with that
name. Um for for two reasons. Um one
>> giraffes may
work from home. Um the second is for my
kids. Uh my son's autistic, so we need
space to spin on things, get sensory
input, things like that. So, um that's
part part of the deal there. Tell us
about that house that existed before
when you bought it, what it was like,
and why it came down so
>> quick. Um, we took one step in, a lot of
lot of issues there. Um, was an Airbnb
previously. Um, some mold issues. I just
felt it was going to be a hazard to
leave it there um as is. Um, we were
planning on building. Um, so I decided
to have it come down so it wasn't an
issue going forward.
>> And you you've had two architects on
this job.
>> Yeah, we've had some struggle some
hiccups going forward. Um my builder
initially had had that someone else that
I just wasn't giving us um you know
plans that I think would be pres
presentable to you guys. Um and so um we
went through a couple rounds of plans
and uh it was a really frustrating
ordeal. Um I basically then uh was
introduced to SC uh Scott um and we
moved on from there.
>> Came a little bit closer to reality.
>> Yes. Yeah.
Yep.
>> Um I hope that addresses questions.
>> Uh so this will be a secondary. We live
in Redbank up north or
>> the microphone. I'm sorry.
>> Oh, I'm sorry.
Sorry.
>> The [snorts] question was this will be a
primary.
>> So this will be secondary residence for
us. Yeah. Um I like I said, I live up in
in Redbank, but we spend quite a bit of
time back and forth here. So
>> thanks.
>> Thank you.
Okay. So we will modify the plan to make
coverage compliant. Perfect.
>> We just ask for the setbacks.
>> Great. Anybody else? No. Anybody from
the public?
>> Public portions closed.
>> Okay. It's a it's a C variance
application. Um based on the testimony,
the fireplace variance and the coverage
variance are going to go away. I'll make
those conditions of approval
uh as well as all standard uh
conditions. Anything in Mr. McCclar's
report, any representations made during
the course of the hearing subject
outside approvals, but it's down to just
the one variance um
which is for the combined sideyard
setbacks. They have a combined they they
meet the minimum of five on each side,
but the combined requirements 12.95
and they are at 11. So that's the one
variance. We'll need a motion and a
second.
>> I'll make that motion.
>> And just before we vote, I'll include
and I'll note in the if approved that
the existing non-conforming the lot area
is undersizing the lot width.
>> And that's included in the motion in the
second.
>> I'm just making sure you guys turn
[clears throat] on your microphones when
you vote.
>> Okay.
Mike Richmond.
>> Okay. So,
um the willingness to make the uh
coverage conform
is uh a good thing.
Like Mr. Patterson said, who cares about
the s the setback on the um parkway
parkway uh parking lot side. Uh it's an
improvement for the neighbor on the
other side because she's getting more of
a setback now. And I don't see any other
issues with it. I'm going to it's a you
know it's a 35 ft lot. So in my mind
that's a little bit of a hardship. So uh
I'm going to improve it.
>> Rich Patterson.
>> Yeah. I'd like to thank the applicant
for complying with the building
coverage. That's a that's a big issue.
Um other than that I I have no problem
with the sideyard setbacks. Just like
Mike said, it's bigger on one side and
the other side doesn't matter. So, I
think it's a good plan and
congratulations,
>> Dan Adams.
>> Yeah, I I agree. Um, I think it's nice
that they agreed to uh keep the
conforming size. Um, one of the things,
you know, I want to add to is growing up
with a family in in a 1300 foot house
until we put an addition on, you need
that space for your kids, and you really
do. And that retreat room or office or
whatever, it's something you need for
your family and need growth. Um the fact
that you kept it under the minimum too
as far as the height, you could have
gone about a little over two feet higher
with the property and I think that's
helping the neighbors as well for air
and light space and because of that I
approve
>> Rich Tolson.
>> The concerns that were identified in the
original application have been met. It's
an improvement to the neighborhood and
we wish you all the best. Good luck. I
approve.
>> Johanna Perski,
>> you're on.
>> Um, I think you've made a lot of
concessions to try your best to make
this work. Um, it certainly isn't an
easy lot to work with and I um I think
this house is going to be beautiful. So,
I approve.
Herb Sagno,
>> I agree with the other members with uh
the concessions you made and the
modifications you made for the lot. Uh
so I approve.
>> Drew Campbell,
>> I agree with my um fellow board members
and I appreciate the efforts you made. I
know it can be frustrating
>> [clears throat]
>> um getting the right plans together and
um making those concessions. So I do
approve as well.
>> Sam Freriedman.
>> I also agree uh with my fellow board
members uh and appreciate the
concessions uh and the good faith effort
made to comply with all uh with all
other aspects. I approve and don't have
a problem with setbacks.
>> John Pit.
>> Yeah. [clears throat] Margate ranks
among the top municipalities in the
state for non-permeable surface. We have
to be doing everything we can in Margate
to increase permeable surface, at least
not make it any worse. So, I appreciate
the concession on the building coverage.
That was going to be my only objection
to it. So, I approve.
Congratulations.
>> Motion carries. Nine in favor and zero.
>> Everybody okay? Anybody need a break or
anything? No.
>> Thank you.
>> Okay.
>> Take care. Good luck.
>> Okay. We're going to take a really short
break, like a five minute break.
>> Okay, we're going to get started again.
>> All righty, here we go. Our next uh case
is Scottstock,
9211 Amherst Avenue, block 526, lot
1.01, 01 zone WSD
minor site plan approval and C variance
relief to establish and operate a
seasonal food stand in the easterly
sideyard for retail food sales. Current
on taxes, water and sewer proof of
notice provided attorney is Christopher
Bson.
Thank you board chairman, board members.
The report is based on the application
of Scottstock 9211 Ammerst Avenue block
526
lot 1.01 located in a waterfront special
district otherwise known as WSD.
Uh [clears throat]
so you can see varants relief minor and
preliminary final site plan amended or
waiver is requested for the site plan.
The background is as follows. The
applicant is seeking approval to
maintain a permanent structure,
permanent temporary structure as an
accessory structure to an existing
business previously approved. The
structure is also between the street and
the building thereby not requiring a cap
or a waterfront development permit. It's
actually along the side and it replaces
a canvas covered quantit or storage
facility.
Uh the building similar to a pered
exterior walk-in box is power connected
or may have power connected to operate
as a hot dog hut to provide for people
returning from fishing trips or people
passing by uh [clears throat] mainly by
foot. There are not any additional
seating or tables proposed as they are
utilizing existing amenities on the
site. The operations are similar to
permitted six-month permit. The
structure would not require building
permits as per UCCC requirements as each
independent structure are considerably
less than 200 square ft. They do however
have to comply with zoning or that's why
they're here seeking some relief. The
applicant is also seeking a waiver from
all the requirements for a minor site
plan as per the attached checklist. The
checklist is attached to the
application. I would agree that a site
plan waiver could be granted without
detriment to this application as the
building itself is not changing, parking
is not changing, lighting is not
changing. It's just an accessory
structure to replace an accessory
structure that's already there. The
zoning chart is on page two. Uh the use
permitted or required uses are mixed use
or commercial. Existing is commercial.
Proposed is commercial. That's not
changing. Uh all the other items are the
same. We get to the accessory structure
where the height maximum height is 8
feet or one story from grade. They are
12 ft but they are less than one story.
So that complies location.
They're not permitted in the front uh
front yard. That is not the case here.
They're actually in the sideyard set
back. Their rear is minimum of 5 ft.
They exceed that. So that's not a
variance. And the only variance that
they need is a sideyard setback variance
where 4T's required. 0.25 ft is is
proposed and that's a variance. And also
they are located in a drainage easement.
However, this is a temporary structure.
There's not going to be any foundation,
but they will be required to be flood
vented and anchored to prevent being
flatom and jetum during a storm. And the
area that they're going to be located
will be in a fenced area. So that will
help contain any debris during event of
a storm. But again, uh you'll need a
flood permit and a zoning permit, not a
construction permit unless you put power
or plumbing in there.
Plans reviewed are a variance plan block
526 lot 1.01. Arthur Ponzi and a company
and I believe Mr. Barnhart's going to
provide some testimony
and confirm some of the questions and
comments I have in my report in regard
to the drainage easement. And again, I I
would recommend a waiver from the minor
site plan requirements. We know where
the bay is. We know the bulkhead is.
That's not changing. Uh again,
section 175-33C,
accessory buildings and structures. Uh 1
C accessory buildings shall be set back
a minimum of five feet from the rear lot
line and four feet to a side lot line.
There's the variance and again the use
is a permitted use. Food retail is is
permitted. I don't see that being an
issue. Uh trash pickup they have trash
facilities on the site already. Mr.
Scott, Mr. Bonner runs a clean ship over
there. So I don't expect that to change
because of a couple hot dogs here and
there. So turn over
my morning everybody. My name is Chris
Balis. I represent um Ray Scott
with us tonight. Uh Scott Stock with
rejected application this evening for a
new aspect of the business which will
serve hot dogs gourmet or I don't know
what you call I I don't like the word
upscale but different variety of hot dog
recipes. um uh four or five choices, but
that's primarily the food product that
you're that they're going to have along
with drinks and chips, things of that
nature. Um and Scott will tell you it's
been a it's been a long time coming.
He's been looking to do to do something
like that. Number one, to increase
revenue. I don't think there's as much
money floating through there as people
think. It takes a lot of bucktails to
make it, you know, sell to make any
money. Um but Scott recently acquired
the business. He bought his sister out.
His mom passed away. He's now the sole
owner and he really wants to take this
into the rest of through the rest of his
life operating it. So, it's something
that Mar market has and can cherish.
It's the coolest thing, one of the
coolest things we have. I mean, Scots is
is iconic. It's a cool cool place. Um,
and then this adds to it. He he tells me
that um people take the rental boats
out, they take their own boats out, they
do say, "Is there anything I can get to
eat to take out on the boat with me for
the same thing when they come in?" And
that makes perfect sense for those of us
who enjoy that kind of lifestyle. Um
there's no there's nowhere really except
Steve's Steve's place when he's open
during the day where you can get
something quick at a stand, take it with
you, take it on the prominade, take it
on the boat, take it to the beach,
wherever you may want without having to
go to Waw Wa um or up to Ver Avenue. So
this kind of fills a cool little niche
that um I think is going to be done very
well. He has partnered with Hillary who
is a 20-year Philadelphia restaurant
tour, recently retired, saw this as an
opportunity to kind of keep her feet in
the business. uh and um try [snorts]
something new and she's really really
excited about it. Um and just as an idea
person, she keeps ideas going and going.
Um we've constrained it to a hot dog
type menu. Um seasonal uh and John can
talk about the plan. I don't want to
keep talking on it.
[snorts]
>> All right, Mr. Barnhart, just uh your
name and business address again for the
record. John Barnhart, 400 North Dober
Avenue, Atlantic City, licensed
professional engineer, liced
professional planner, certified
municipal engineer.
>> Okay. Please raise your right hand. You
swear from the testimony you give this
evening to be the truth.
>> I do.
>> Okay.
>> John, you can you you start a project
with me. Basically, you can tell us what
what's going on and what we're
just for the record, Mr. Chairman, will
Mr. Barnhard as an engineer and planner,
his credentials are accepted.
>> Yes.
>> Thank you. All yours. Okay. So, um uh
the plan I have before you was the plan
that was submitted with the application.
There's no changes to that. Um upper
right corner of the plan is a survey of
the property. Um you can see um in the
upper right corner, uh the if you're
standing on Ammerst Avenue facing
Scottstock, the area to the right, um
there's kind of like a fabric quanset
hut there now that actually doesn't even
show on that survey. And then there's a
a shed behind that. And then there's the
garage behind that all in that sideyard.
The proposal is to eliminate the quanet
hut uh eliminate the uh the existing
shed and then to install a food
concession and another small shed behind
the food concession that you can see in
the blowup site plan that I that is in
the lower left portion uh of our of our
plan.
>> Let me stop you for one second. If you
guys look at Roger's report, there's
pictures in there that show the Quanza
we're talking about. It's that large
structure large long structure up
against the fence that's going away. I'm
sorry. So the the idea is that the is
that um the food concession will will
sit uh perpendicular or par
perpendicular to the building or
parallel to Amherst Avenue. Uh you would
come in uh to the right side of the uh
of the building. If you're familiar with
the site, that's also the path that that
uh folks take to get to the dock in the
back. Um you'll be able to order uh at
in front of that structure. I wish I
could
>> John, I have it up here, too.
>> Oh, okay. Do you see please?
>> So, you'd be able to uh could you scroll
that over to the the site plan, please?
Lower left there.
>> There we go.
>> So, you you see you see the food
concession structure is is 25 ft back
from the front property line. You'll be
able to walk in the gate that's just to
the right of the existing Scottstock
building. Um you see the order and
pickup area. Uh and that will be a that
will be an open window in the front
where you order and pick up your hot
dogs. Uh the back the area behind it,
that shed and that little fenced in area
uh is really just kind of back of house
for operating the hot dog stand um for
for other dry goods and things. Um and
then just it's just fenced off so folks
can't get to the access points of the
shed or the food concession this area
here.
>> That's correct. Um it's positioned in a
fashion that doesn't interrupt the the
passage of people getting trying to get
to the marina and to the boats in the
back which is why we're staying down.
>> Correct. which is why we're staying
clear of that walkway. Uh and then folks
that that are not going to leave the
site and would like to sit and enjoy the
water um and um actually have their have
their meal at the at the facility, we
are proposing uh three picnic tables uh
toward the water adjacent to the
boardwalk. And next to those picnic
tables, we will have trash receptacles
so that folks can sit there, enjoy the
enjoy the bayront um and then and then
leave at um when they're complete. John,
in the summer time there's actually some
tips and chairs out here already for
people who are waiting for rental boats
waiting for their boat.
>> That's that that's correct. Yeah, that
area is already used for seating. So, um
this is this is an interesting thing
because as Chris said, um Scottstock is
um it's an iconic little space. It's not
it's not giant, but it's the last one
left in Margate. And honestly, I do a
lot of work on the barrier island. It's
one of the last ones left on this
island. um they're going away uh as
quickly as they had. It's it's a shame.
Um all the way all the way into
Brigantine. I mean, every every one of
them is turning into residential at this
point. And um we have somebody who's
trying to find a way to generate a
little bit more revenue to stay relevant
to to and to and to stay here and be a
real anchor Damhurst Avenue in an area
that for many many years, as we know,
has been known as an area for fishermen.
And this is the only place fishermen can
go now. So th this is a this is a neat
little plan. It has very little impact
on on anybody. Um it's really a cleanup
of that sideyard which is right now
being used for storage
that 0.25 gets that against that propert
>> and the only variance is that is the
sideyard set back to the accessory
structure where 4T is required and we're
proposing 0.25 ft. Um but if you visit
the site what you'll see is that there's
a fence along that property line and
there's also a large thick hedge row
along that property line. So, so the
visual impact of it being only only 0.25
ft off the property line is what we
think is irrelevant and it's positioned
in a location that has no no negative uh
impact uh on the neighboring property or
any of the other surrounding properties.
>> On the master plan and Marian's
ordinance, you think that's a
complimentary addition to Scott being
aware of it the way you are?
>> Oh, I I absolutely do. I mean, this is
your this is your waterfront special
district. Um you know, you're trying to
promote uh the use and enjoyment of the
waterfront. this is a way in which to do
that. Um, you know, Scottstock is just
providing another um, you know, while
it's while it's dining, it's really it's
really um, it's it's it's creating a a
situation for folks to be able to come
here, grab a hot dog, and then go enjoy
the waterfront while they're eating,
which is, you know, which is what you
want along your waterfront um, in
appropriate areas. And with the with as
long as this property has been here, um,
I think everybody would argue that this
is a very appropriate accessory use to
this site. What about any impacts to to
the public good? Any impact to the zone
plan and zoning ordinance?
>> No, this does not generate additional
parking demand. Um, obviously we all
know that the the parking considerations
along Amherst Avenue. Um, this is a
somebody that's already coming to
Amherst Avenue. Maybe they're maybe they
were um maybe they were fishing that
day. Maybe they were maybe they're just
going to pull up on their boat. They
happen to know that it's here and
they're going to pull up to one of um
one of Scott Stock's um slips and walk
up and grab a hot dog and then leave on
their boat. Um it's it's a going to be a
neighborhood type of thing. This is
obviously not going to be a giant draw
of people that are coming here by
vehicle uh to uh to pick up a hot dog.
That's that's not that's not what this
is. Um but hopefully it'll be very
successful. Um and we think it's very
very much appropriate.
>> Thank you very much, Scott. Ray.
[clears throat]
>> Hello everyone.
>> Ray, I just got to just give us your
name and address for the record. Ray
Scott Bonner 9211 Amherst Avenue
>> and please raise your right hand. You
swear part of the testimony you're about
to give will be the truth.
>> Yes.
>> Thanks.
>> Scott, you are now the sole owner of the
property.
>> Correct.
>> And and operate yourself.
>> Yes.
>> Uh and um tell the board what we're
doing.
>> Um we have my family's been doing
business in Margate for 67 years now. Um
I'm doing everything I can to uh keep
the place and improve upon it throughout
the rest of my career. And food is a
topic uh that comes up after a day on
the water or beforehand regularly. So I
believe that this is going to fit right
into what we already do here and be a
part of the family uh business and
environment that has been there forever.
Um in addition to that, my bedroom
window is about 10 ft above where this
is going to be taking place. So I do not
intend on it to be um a disturbance to
the neighborhood in any way, shape or
fashion. uh as that I open my retail
store and tackle shop very early in the
morning, seven days a week. So, um I've
spoke with all of my neighbors who are
supportive and I don't believe any are
here uh in uh being like a 2 a.m. uh
drug hot dog stand. No, I've uh I've
spent most of my life in that building
and seen what comes from Amherst Avenue
and you know participated myself once or
twice and um have moved beyond that and
uh are trying to get to bed early to uh
get up and serve the fisherman right
right and early
>> and we're fortunate enough to partner up
with Hillary who has significant
experience in the restaurant industry.
>> Hillary owned a restaurant in on South
Street in Philly for 20 years. Uh she's
an extremely enthusiastic person, very
driven, and I have the utmost confidence
that she is going to be a great addition
to the property.
>> Thank you very much.
>> Thank you, board members. That's that's
all we have.
>> Okay.
>> I got a couple questions.
>> Go ahead.
>> Um Chris, is it this is going to be open
to the public, not just people who are
voting?
>> Oh, no. Open to the public.
>> Okay. Um a group of 10 kids is riding
their bike down Amharst Avenue. They can
go in and get hot.
>> Absolutely.
>> And their bikes are going to go
>> where they put them now in front of
front of the building.
>> Drew, can you turn your microphone on?
>> Don't go up against the fence. Where
they go now? We're up against the
building.
>> There's bike racks past it, too.
>> Right at the park.
>> Sure. Margate Citizens Advisory
Committee gets this year.
>> There we go.
The reason why I asked that is because
when you when you start something
especially like with food, okay, that
can really blossom into, [clears throat]
you know, a nice business.
>> And if there are really good hot dogs,
right? You know,
you could have dollar dog, you could
start doing dollar days, right, on
Tuesdays. You may not see that
>> and have hundreds of people coming.
>> You're not gonna see that,
>> right? Um
I mean, it's a great idea. I love it. Um
my only concern is like how many people
from the public are going to go there to
that small area. Um and
you know cause congestion possibly, you
know, is it going to be uh like the a
lot of trash cans there? If it turns
into a thriving business, are you going
to have to have a dumpster there now?
you know, which could
>> there is there is one there,
>> you know, like there are those kinds of
unforeseen things that
>> But do you think the setback's going to
be a problem though?
>> I don't.
>> Okay.
>> No. Um, and then
6:00 in the morning when I get up and I
go fishing, you know,
>> hot dog.
>> I'm not having a hot dog. You know,
>> is there going to be a breakfast
sandwich? Could we have breakfast
sandwiches or some scrapple possibly?
>> It's going to be called the Drew
Campbell breakfast sandwich.
>> Scrapple would be incredible. something
like that.
>> They don't even sell it at castles
anymore, so
>> we'll do our best to control the bike
traffic.
>> Perfect.
>> Anybody else?
>> Yeah. Will you do Chicago style hot
dogs?
>> I hope so.
>> Whatever you want.
>> Just Mr. Chairman, I don't know if this
is more of a must issue or if I could
ask you, what is the anchoring system?
>> Any idea? So typ typically the way you
would anchor um it's basically a sea box
shipping container. Typically the way
that they get anchored um is
[clears throat] with like an augur. So
it's it's an augur that gets screwed
into the ground and then stainless strap
that comes off the augur and ties to the
to the sebox.
>> I didn't see it.
>> You said that's a um it's like a
shipping container
>> essentially. Yes.
>> Same thing they have with tomatoes.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> And John, just to clarify, cuz I think I
heard Rogers say it, but it's going to
have like flood vents or something on
it, too. So, won't be able to The shed
will. Oh, the shed will. Okay.
>> All right. That's fine.
>> Okay. Just want to point out one more
thing. In our master plan from 2016
2017,
one of the objectives is [clears throat]
to maintain and protect our commercial
businesses.
Uh I I believe this plan is doing that.
I believe this board is heading in that
direction tonight to make sure that is
continued and trust me on the next
master plan that protecting commercial
businesses will be in that master plan.
Um it's essential to market.
That's it.
Okay. Anybody else from the board?
Well, I just like to say it's a positive
aspect
because we've been wanting to get more
food food uh stores down there,
>> right? Yep.
>> Um, are you going to have veggie dogs?
[laughter]
>> Yes.
>> Okay.
[laughter]
>> I tell you, you guys are going to be
impressed. Very impressive.
>> Okay. Anyone from the public?
>> Oh, hell yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> I got this.
>> Hello everybody, ladies and gentlemen of
the committee. Uh Pete Brightinger, 407
North Quincy Avenue. Right hands up.
Swear to God on my dad's grave.
Everything.
>> All right.
>> Uh not to waste your time, man. We're
out here in in the bitter cold, but um
we were here last year uh in front of
you uh asking [clears throat] for the
property for uh Scottstock that the city
owned to renew the the lease to allow
him to keep his boats there. And I think
we made a wise decision. You know, like
he said, it's a business that's been
open for 67 years. I had the pleasure as
a as a young uh born born and raised in
Margate, uh still at the same residence
on Quincy Avenue. Um, I worked for his
grandparents and uh and was able to uh
feed some information um while his
mother ran the the business and now
Scott has it. And as was mentioned
earlier, unfortunately after her death
um her he had to buy his sister out. So
it it was a strain on Scott as a uh
private business owner.
Uh, I can't, you know, my my thought is
we're talking about a small stand and
and Drew, you mentioned, you know, what
happens if uh if uh these fantastic
food, which I know you're going to
provide, uh is is an issue. Um you know,
I talked to uh Sean uh
um I'm sorry, I'm I'm drawing a blank
over, but the new marina um Scar Bro,
thank you. And I asked him the other day
and I said, "You know, this beautiful
marina that that you're going to build,
which I think is is amazing for
Margate." I said, "But you have limited
parking that the previous owner had."
And he said, "Well, we're hoping to get
a lot of locals here and we're going to
put up bike racks and we're hoping
everybody bikes here and and doesn't
have to utilize all the parking spaces."
Um, I think that uh goes along with what
you're doing on Ammerst Avenue. We built
a boardwalk. You know, I was skeptical
because I keep my boat at uh at at Barry
Coast and I thought for sure I wasn't
going to get a parking spot when I
needed my boat. With this new boardwalk
going up, the water park memories
getting rebuilt. It's it's amazing that
you're bringing Margate back to life. Um
if you look around and we ride our bikes
and walk up and down the streets, you
know, we see these houses that we all
grew up in or our friends grew up in and
they're torn down and these big houses
are going up. We're we're becoming a a
shore town. Um, keeping the heritage of
Margate alive. Um, I don't think there's
another business in this area that's
familyowned that's been in uh been in
existence longer than Scottstock. If you
look, you know, throughout our our
history of of Margate, um, I think, uh,
you know, with with Tidelines, it's
great addition. I think uh memories uh
if you're down there at 2:00 in the
morning going fishing for tuna like I do
and you see 300 kids walking down the
street to go from bar to bar. It's not
an issue of whether or not we're
overcrowding the area. You're giving it
you're giving the business a business an
opportunity to strive. I can tell you
for years as a boat owner, you had to go
offshore to get tackle or bait and
everything. And then Scott came along
and he said, "What can I do to better my
business?" Well, you know, you start
selling bait, you start selling
offshore, you start selling this. And he
did it. And, you know, he he became a a
mechanic. He still has a a lift that he
can work his boats and and when there's
problems in the area, he's the first one
to dive in and offer his services as a
marina or as a mechanic or as a
operator, a engineer. Um, I think it
would be an injustice not to give this
place the opportunity to thrive, for him
to stay in Margate, to to raise his
family, to keep this family legacy
going. Uh whether it's selling hot dogs
or whether he's selling sandwiches. I
don't think there's a uh competition
clause with anybody on that street.
Steve Marshall has built his empire
there with his with his barbecue and and
his seafood and now a doughnut hut. Um,
I think um, you know, Carmen and and
like I said, Tidelines and Maynards and
and everybody on that street coexist.
I'd love to see the Barbrey Coast come
back. So, honestly, without going on and
on, I I if we have to put a bike rack
out there for for Scott, for the 10 kids
that want to come up and get a hot dog,
I think that's that's an easy fix. Uh,
but honestly, uh, what what better way
to to keep the heritage of of what
you're trying to do on Ammeris Avenue?
Look at all the u the the the flags you
put up to honor our our heroes in
Margate that that the veterans and now
you're redoing uh Washington Avenue with
the same way. This is just another icing
on the cake. Give this guy, you're three
for three tonight. Go four for four.
Give this guy his his permit and and let
this let this happen and all of you I I
guarantee all of you and your families
will enjoy it. That's all I got to say.
Enjoy it.
Okay. Anybody else from the public?
>> Public portions closed.
>> Oh All right.
>> Keep it short.
>> More.
>> Uh Ed Burger 9402 Ammerst Avenue. The
president of Marley Business
Association. Yes, I am.
>> You swear to tell the truth?
>> Yes. Yes, I do. Just, you know, a quick
reminder and on on Pete's heels and and
uh everything was explained already.
Everybody knows how difficult it is for
a business to survive in a seasonal
community. And then you take a business
like Scots where you know Scott's the
last man standing. I mean, let's let's
face it. I mean, as as it comes down to
a marina where people can actually go,
you have to look at both the business
itself and what he's trying to do with
it. And then you look at the individual.
Scott's the guy who always volunteers to
help out the community. Scott's the guy
that hosted our fundraiser that we do
for our scholarship fund. When it's time
for us to do Funfest, it's Scott that
contributes his property and his area to
do the Wetlands Wonderland so the kids
that are coming into the area get better
educated and better understand what's
going on on the other side of the
bulkhead.
This guy needs to have a a firm foothold
in his business or we are going to
continue to slip away from what Margate
used to be. So, for a minor variance and
a hot dog trailer, I mean, you know, to
me, this is a no-brainer. And I hope all
you guys just
approve it and let's go home.
[clears throat]
>> Okay. Anyone else from the public? No.
Public portion is closed.
>> Good. Anything else, Chris or board?
>> All right.
And Chris, you site plan waiver with the
>> So
the relief that's being requested, it's
it's a site plan waiver because they're
just adding this this uh accessory
structure. They're not changing the
building or anything like that. So the
applicants asking for a site plan waiver
with one variance for the sideyard
setback to the accessory
uh building 4 feet the requirement and
they're at 0.25 ft. Uh Mr. McCclaron has
set forth the
reports of those conditions will be
incorporated. Um, anything else
represented to during the course of the
hearing? Subject to any outside
approvals, if any that are required. Um,
and you know, as far as the anchoring in
the flood zone, flood vents. I believe
that's in Rogers ordinance, but they
they're part of the
>> right hand that structure,
>> right? [clears throat]
>> That's that's the motion and the second
we'll need and we'll need a roll call
vote.
>> Make that motion. second
>> Mike Richmond.
>> Uh yeah, as far as the um
variance goes,
there's no impact. I don't see any
impact on the neighborhood or the
neighbor or anybody for that. Um in
fact, in residential, is it a one foot
for a shed? I thought it was
>> for residential zone. Yes.
>> Right. Right.
So anyway, uh yeah, it's a great
improvement like everybody said. Um it's
a great thing. I I grew up in Morgate,
too. I actually grew up across the
street from Pete
[laughter]
Neighborhood Terror. But uh anyway, um
no, I think it's a good thing and I'm
going to approve it.
>> Rich Patterson,
>> I also approve. I think it's a great
thing and anything we can do to help
help uh Scott is is a good thing here. I
don't see any detriments to it. So, I
approve.
>> Dan Adams.
>> Yeah. I just want to echo a couple
things. You know, Chris talked about and
the people in the audience. You know,
there was when I was a kid growing up
here, we had four different choices to
go for bait and tackle and to go and and
get what we needed. You know, we always
went to Scottstock to get a boat and
rent a boat because that's where that's
where we went. That's what was there.
Um, now we're down to one and he is the
last man standing. and this is a way to
improve the area and make it better. I
think it's a great thing. Um, you know,
I participate in going to Scottstock on
a regular basis when I need something.
Um, to touch on what, you know, Drew
said about the kids, I hope 10 kids show
up there on bikes and want to get hot
dogs because if you come down here on
any given Friday, Saturday, or Sunday
and go to the Dairy Bar or to Two Cents
Plane or the Waw Wa, there's not 10
kids, there's 150, 200 kids. And the
bikes aren't a problem there. And
everybody makes it work. And you make it
work together because that's what
community is all about. with making
things work for the community. With that
said, I strongly support this concept
and this idea.
>> Just want
[laughter]
full price.
>> Rich Tolson.
>> Yes. Um, for those that don't know, I
was born and raised in Ocean City. Moved
to Margate six years ago. I've seen a
town lose its soul. Um Scott's stock
clearly based on testimony here tonight
is part of the soul of Margate. One of
the things that hasn't been spoken about
today um that doesn't have to do with
zoning but it has to do with the soul of
the town is the employment that is
offered there. the jobs as Pete talked
about working there 75 years ago when he
was a kid [laughter]
that
>> they uh that's an important element of
it and it's a benefit to the community.
I see no detriment to the community and
I wish you all the best and I approve
this.
Johanna Perski.
>> Um, so my kid will actually be the one
on the bike, probably not locked up and
eating hot dogs. Um, I think it's a
great idea. I think, um, one thing that
wasn't mentioned was that not only is
this what our town needs for our
families. Um, but
Ray Scott is also doing a program at the
school and they're teaching the next
generation of boys to fish, which is
boys and girls to fish, which is so
important for for us as a community. So,
I think this expansion will just further
attract kids to um what they need and
that's outdoor activities that they can
do with their families. So, I approve
Herb Pagna,
>> I agree with everyone here. It's an
awesome idea. Anything we can do to help
the local businesses, especially Scott,
he doing a fantastic job. Like Pete
said, bringing in additional tackle. We
used to have to run offshore, run the
fanatics, run wherever. And uh you know,
ain't that right, Glenna? You know, it's
just no captain Andes, nothing. It's
it's Scott and he's doing a fantastic
job. And good luck with this new
venture.
Drew Campbell.
>> I approve.
[laughter]
>> Okay, [clears throat]
>> Drew Campbell.
>> Um, I love the idea. I love it. Um, I
can't wait to be a patron there. Um, and
I
also echo uh other board members and the
history and the contributions that you
do make to Margate. Um uh I can add to
the Margate Anglr Club, the pier and um
the participation and contributions that
you make there to promoting fishing
there as well. Um and I appreciate all
of that and uh I absolutely approve
>> Steve Joki.
I have to echo what everybody else has
said and also that Scott
has been such a um a steward for
educating people about the Back Bay and
he's been a great asset to the
community.
I see no detriment at all. I see nothing
but a positive aspect to what for this
application. So, I approve.
>> John Piss.
Um I'm a relatively new resident of uh
Margate, but uh one of the reasons my
wife and I moved into Margate was
because of the very unique environment
and atmosphere in Margate. And uh
Scott's doc is certainly a a key part of
that um as evidenced by the testimony
from everyone here tonight. So uh I
approve. I would just make a quick
comment to the planning board. We've
recently approved two of these sort of
temporary food structures in the
waterfront uh district. We need to be
sure that we treat each one of these
individually. The two that we approved
were definitely worth it, but I can
imagine we might get some other folks in
town will come in and say, uh, you know,
gave two of those on the waterfront
district. I want one on Ventner Avenue,
right? We have to treat each one
individually. But in summary, I approve.
Congratulations. Good luck.
One more Chicago.
>> Motion carries. Nine in favor and zero.
>> Thank you very much.
>> The night's not over yet.
>> Appreciate all you guys do. Thank you
everybody.
[laughter]
>> Okay.
He's not showing up here.
>> Joanne is recusing herself for the for
the last application. So,
>> okay,
>> she's dismissed.
>> Okay,
>> dismissed. All right, our last case is
Gem Hospitality
Inc., 7811 Ventner Avenue, block 206.02,
lot 2, CBD zone. um site plan waiver to
operate a takeout doughnut shop known as
Sunny's House of Donuts. Current on
taxes, water and sewer proof of notice
provided. Attorney is Christopher
Balinsson.
>> Thank you, M chairman, board members.
The report is based on the application
of Gen Hospitality Inc. 7811 Vetner
Avenue, block 206.02,
lot 2, CVD zone. Um the premium
requirements don't comply or don't
matter at this point in time. Seeking a
site plan waiver. This is a final
planning and zoning report for
substantial benefits. That the
background is as follows. The applicant
is proposing to
take an existing non-conforming
residential structure in the commercial
zone and actually make it commercial,
which is a novel idea.
The zoning chart is on page two and I
identified one variance and you I I
looked at it sideways, upside down and
everything any other way.
But
because you're changing the use, you
need a variance for the parking where
three spaces for commercial required,
zero spaces are available, zero spaces
are proposed. And again, you can't you
couldn't make the parking work there if
you had if you could
>> because of the ADA parking requirements.
And we've discussed this project before
where it's a non-conforming
structure in regard to ADA compliance.
However, our construction official, we
met and discussed it and because it's an
existing structure, they don't have to
comply with the ADA compliance issues.
So that is the only variance identified.
And I just want to say that the site
plan waiver could be granted because of
the comment number one when site plan or
subdivision approval required. Uh A1 the
following shall be exempt from board
action. Then item C general business and
professional offices. This is a general
business is retail. Necessarily say this
is a restaurant where they're full
seating fully enclosed restaurant. I I
think this is retail general business.
Um [clears throat] if this was
commercial going to residential, it'd be
a different story. It' be a use fair. It
would be parking requirements uh would
have to be obtained.
And also having that curb cut not be
used on the veterary avenue is not a bad
thing at that location. That's that's
pretty tight area. So the site was and
nearly 100% impervious. That is not
changing. this the site's really not
changing there. Looks like they're
providing adequate trash enclosures in
the back. Um just the hours of
operation, Chris, if you could describe
that during your testimony.
And
the other caveat, if this was existing
commercial and they're just changing
from retail donuts or to retail hot
dogs,
no onsite parking shall be required
because the existing non-residential
floor area within the central business
district. It's not changing. So because
it's residential, that drives the
parking variance. And again, just it's
semantics, but that's that is what it
is. Um, I really have no further
comments. I think this is a another
example of protecting our business
zones. If this was going the other way
where we're losing businesses to
residential here, that would be a bad
thing. Here we are adding commercial.
Um, but I I see no issue with that. And
I will reserve Oh, the sign there.
There's no dimensions provided for the
sign. You would need a zoning permit for
the sign. And again, hopefully you
comply with what's permitted. If not,
>> that's that's the intention.
>> Okay. Yeah,
>> I figure
>> if not you would come back here, but we
can we'll make sure that works out.
>> Sure. Of course.
>> Okay.
>> I represent Sunny Tonas Royber Goldberg
here tonight. And speaking of the
warfront special district, I can't think
of anybody who was in work at the Tony
of the Warfront special district and Roy
Joy [clears throat]
spent most of his life back there with
juniors and with the office building
funfest the conscious night the guy who
was responsible for most of those good
times is right here. Um the idea with
Sunny's Donuts is to bring the Junior's
Donuts concept up to Vendor Avenue in a
in a space that has been used as
residential though in a strictly
commercial zone um for since its
inception. Um the idea is to convert
that to commercial space as it should
be. One of the primary purposes of
zoning as we all have talked about is
bringing properties into performance
ordinance. That is exactly what this
application does. The site plan waiver
is requested because there's no site
changes. to be able to use the building
as it is. Um Tom will tell you that
essentially
the stairs here continue to be there.
They're going to people are going to
flow in here and out over here right
across the front. There's about 200 ft
of retail space which would be less than
one parking space be one space variance
would be for one one space. I don't
necessarily agree that a variance would
be required because it's commercial
space. It just so happen to be used as
residential. So if you look at it as as
existing commercial space that was used
in a performing matter and it's always
been commercial space never that never
changed um just happened to use
residential it wouldn't require you know
one space because it's existing it's
only it's always been commercial space
just happened to use in a nonformal
manner. So annex as Roger said it's not
it's it's one v it's one space
nonetheless. So if the board's
comfortable saying let's grant that
variance um let's consider that variance
that as well. Um
>> I think it goes by the gross floor area,
but I mean stick with the three.
>> Okay.
Um Tom
>> Tomo prepared the plan. It's a real
quick explanation how it's going to
operate. I'll go ahead.
>> All right. Mr. Belevo, just give us uh
[clears throat] your name and address
for the record, please.
>> Tom Bagivo Bivo,
>> 472 Northtown Road, Blue.
>> Okay. And please raise your right hand.
>> Living on Furlow.
>> Okay. And please raise your right hand.
You swear a frame of testimony you're
about to give will be the truth.
>> I do.
>> And licensed architect in the state of
New Jersey. You've been here. Board's
familiar with it
>> several times. Yeah. All over New
Jersey.
>> Okay. Over 12 states.
>> Okay. With the strangles, Mr. Richmond.
>> Mhm.
>> Yeah.
>> Um Tom, without me asking a million
questions, when Roy came to you, what is
it he explained to you he'd like to do
and what did you accomplish to address
that?
Well, first he wanted to bring back
great buildings to market.
But in this existing structure, what we
did with Royy's input is
99% if not 100% take out inside the
structure 100%. So, we're coming in the
front door
up these steps and our idea together was
to put another door so that we had a
flow. If you remember when Junior's was
on the bay, it was just keep people
moving. So,
>> oh, this area kind of where the window
is.
>> Yeah. Where the first window is on the
side, right?
>> It actually is portrayed in the drawing.
Actually, I wonder
make it cleaner up there.
Yeah.
So, the idea would be to come in the
current front door. All this would
remain. So, you'd be under a roofed
porch in the front door. You grab a
donut,
you mix your coffee, and you go right
out the door. So, the traffic is just
foot traffic right through.
75% of the first floor is making of the
donuts and sales. So it literally is
there's not even room in here for tables
and chairs. So we'd have trash recycling
inside down these steps.
Additional storage would be in the
current garage
structures. This was updated. You can
put two recycling bins and two trash
bins. full size trash toers with um a
concealed area in the back and the ramps
are just before employees. That's just
ramp product from there in and then we
offer
conventional and ADA seating on the
side. Tom, if there is concern about
handy somebody wants you to there's a
ramp in the back of your
>> Well, the ramp is there's not enough
room for an ADA ramp because of
>> five steps for we're 39 in out of the
ground. So, the ramp would be 40 ft long
plus landings. So, the ramp would
probably go to Hot Pickles and more or
so. But um there's an additional service
window here if necessary that could be
open just for
ADA components if needed. But for the
most part, I mean you come in the
current steps and write down less stairs
on the side. So no structural changes to
the building other than the equipment.
>> What are you doing to the outside of the
building to make it look pretty on that?
>> Well, the the redesign would be mostly
painting for color. and signage. So, we
have the new Sunny's logo,
repaint the building, add planner boxes,
and kind of dress up
>> the outside so it feels more commercial
than res
what your vision is.
>> All right. Uh, Mr. Goldberg, just give
us your name.
>> Roy Goldberg. Four North Nashville
Avenue.
>> Everybody kept saying, "Why am I doing
this?"
>> You swear to tell the truth. [laughter]
>> Why am I bringing Why am I doing this?
And as Mr. Pollson said, Margie did lose
a big portion of what kids should do.
And I remember very clearly the faces of
the kids when they got donuts. When
you're on vacation, you'll eat anything
in the world you eat. So hot dogs on the
bed is a very good idea. people will eat
whatever they can while they're on
vacation. So, this building was there.
Um, I don't want to change it. I want it
to look like an old fashioned doughut
store. That's why it's called the House
of Donuts, cuz it's going to stay like a
house. Um, and you put a gorgeous new
parking lot 400 yards from me. So, I
hope it's 7:00 in the morning.
Everybody's pulling in that parking lot
to come and have donuts.
>> Great. Your concept is generally to have
to have the store open 6:00 in the
morning to noon generally.
>> Yes. Uh at the moment, donuts, cinnamon
buns, and coffee. No hot dogs, no fruit,
nothing healthy. [laughter]
When you go on vacation, you don't want
to eat a donut. Um the donuts were good.
Um I did I opened the first one in 2001,
which was 24 years ago. Wow.
>> Years ago
Junior, but Junior is now 37 years old.
So Sunny was my father. So I named it
after my father. And you bought the
building.
>> I bought the building. Um and
the inside needed a lot of work. So
we're good. I got a great architect.
What's up there?
>> Seasonal or year round?
>> Seasonal. 110 days.
>> Uh qu question. Um uh well what's going
to be with the uh second floor?
>> The second floor with storage and one
room three is an office.
>> Okay.
>> Yeah. And and uh you're not you going to
have like any seating on that front
porch? Would that front porch be usable?
It's too small.
>> Pretty small.
>> Like a high boy. Well, it will be lined
up on that
>> front was to utilize down here to get
people out of the building.
>> Yeah.
>> Personally, the first time I moved into
Margate
>> years ago, I was here. I came back in
2014 and my next door neighbor bought a
dozen donuts.
>> Yeah.
>> And you're not You just get your donuts
and bring them home. But for the most
part, we have seating down here, which
we then introduce a layer of uh
shrubbery on the side to kind of soften
the side of the property. People are
going to go in and eat their donuts out
here. There's really I mean that porch
is 5 and 1/2 ft wide.
>> See, we're assuming that porch is going
to have people on it.
>> That's what I was getting at. Like
everybody's waiting in line for donuts.
They're going to be queued up on the
porch waiting to get in.
>> No, I think it's a great idea having
outside seating. Too bad you can't have
inside seating, but like people need
places to congregate and you're you're
adding that.
>> You know,
>> but all those years you had no inside se
>> from a hardship stand. There's no place
for public parking
parking on the site the way it's been
utilized.
>> No.
>> The area has a parking lot now across
the street
>> somewhat. Yeah. Did you think the
variance would be granted without
attachments to public good without jet
of the ordinance the land fact was
available park?
>> Correct. I agree.
>> Thank you.
>> And and again the fact is a bike crack
scenario.
>> I mean every time I I went before any
other place you take a vote for
>> that's all. Thank you.
>> Okay.
>> Anyone from the board? So I I I thought
I heard Roger say it, but So are we
doing away with the driveway altogether?
So that in technicality creates parking.
Correct.
>> Do away with the driveway for
the tables.
>> Yeah, but I'm saying the spot on the
street where the driver apron is.
>> That would be technically a parking
spot. Correct.
>> Okay. Street.
>> Yeah. Street space out there. Yeah.
Okay.
>> You might be able to use that as a
loading zone, too. probably just lead
the curb cut in there so you can
probably serves the other businesses
too.
>> All right. [laughter]
>> Um, anybody else from the board?
>> You know, just one comment if I could,
Mr. Chairman. It was just mentioned by a
couple people about people lining up on
the porch.
I don't know if that's an accurate
description only because the location of
the door to enter. They're probably
going to come down the steps. So, it
just raises consideration of how you
might handle that. Hopefully, as busy as
you anticipated to be um how they line
up on the sidewalk because they're not
>> they're not going to be on the porch.
>> Mike, can I jump in on that? Sure.
>> The whole concept of the second door
where the first window is
is to keep people moving through
>> so you don't have to come out the front
door that. But if they're backing up
waiting to get in,
>> they're not going to line up on that
porch because the door the entrance
>> the entrance door is on the front, not
the one on the driveway side. Correct.
>> Yep.
>> You understand my point?
>> I mean, it's almost like something used
to go to banks. We queue
>> I mean if you if he's that busy and we
queue left and right five and a half ft
good for a long
person with samples on the porch right
[clears throat] on the porch. [laughter]
>> Hey he wants to make a lot of dough.
>> You're going to have Chicago style
donuts too.
>> Okay. We have Chicago style hot dogs.
We'll have Chicago style donuts.
Hot dogs are on the bay.
>> No, the Chicago style donuts are
>> deep deep dish donuts.
Um, okay.
One thing I Nobody else from the board.
One thing I want to say, uh, which is
obviously helping this and helping is
that, uh, the forethought for the city
of Margate to buy that parking lot. I
know there was a little bit of
consternation about that, but that was
probably, you know, great move
>> and I hope, you know, that, you know,
they invested maybe one or two other
properties to do that because, uh, that
really alleviates a lot of the parking
situation there. So, all right. Nobody
else from the board? Anybody from the
public?
I have to admit
that being on the agenda
tonight when I was here I came from SC
was here that Sunny's was up
you know the contributions that Mr. was
made in his junior over the course of
years. I think everyone's grown up after
he's contributed to this community.
Thrilled to have him back in the game
even closing.
Um but that's not what I want. Um the
fact that we're taking a piece of
residential real estate and going
commercial with it as the president
business association is kind of like
this unicorn
>> that we're not doing some sort of
multi-user thing. Um, I approve I
approve wholeheartedly on that go to see
that
Junior's Donut is across the street from
the house. 10year-old granddaughter of a
seven-year-old granddaughter and tell
her that Sunny's juniors is going to be
don
John.
>> Okay. Anybody else from the public?
>> Okay, Chris, stop talking. Uh, all
right. Public portion's closed.
>> All right. There's no other questions.
We should I think the best bet is to
keep it aggressive. That's right. We'll
call it three required parking services.
>> All right. So, it's it's a
application. Again, it's a minor site
plan approval because very little on the
site's changing and based on Roger, our
site plan waiver
because of a formal site plan is not
required given the the the building's
really not changing based on Roger's
comments and one variance which is the
required number of parking spaces. Three
are required. There's none there now
proposed and the conditions will be
pretty much the standard conditions.
anything Mr. McCarn's report applicant
will comply with any representation made
during the course of the hearing subject
to any outside approvals that may might
be required just the standard stuff. So
I need a motion, a second call.
>> I'll make that motion.
>> Michael Richmond,
>> great addition. Approve it.
Rich Patterson.
U I've been [clears throat] on the board
for 20 years and uh this is the first
night where there's actually two yes
votes where I'm thrilled to vote yes to
have this
um residential turn back into commercial
and bring Roy back into town. And
nothing good this is bad to say about
it.
Yes.
>> Dan Adams. Yeah, I agree. It's going to
be an improvement to the community,
adding commercial space, and my three
grandchildren are going to be very happy
to be able to get donuts and a good
donuts at that. So, I approve.
>> Rich Tullson.
>> Yeah, there's obviously a a
business benefit to the community.
There's an aesthetic benefit to Ventner
Avenue along there. There's a benefit to
all this to have donuts. Um, so I
approve
>> her Pagna.
>> So, um, yeah, I I agree with everyone on
the board. I approve. Good luck,
>> Drew Campbell.
>> I think it's a great idea. Um, benefits
the city. Um, great parking 400 ft away
from you. Um, definitely a no-brainer. I
approve.
And I hope you're gonna have powdered
lemon fil donuts.
>> Steve Joaki,
>> I I see this as a a a very positive
benefit for the city. Um people need
places to go and you're providing that.
I um and I'm like the reversal of
getting more businesses because I've
always want I always want protective
businesses. So I approve.
Sam Freriedman.
>> I would agree with uh with the rest of
the board members uh bringing back a
commercial uh a commercial um place
business. Thank you. Commercial business
uh into this area. Uh yeah, I see no uh
no harm.
>> I agree. I approve.
>> John P.
>> Uh yeah, I agree with everything
everyone else has said. That site should
definitely be commercial. Um, I
mentioned earlier, uh, [clears throat]
my wife and I are relatively recent to
Margate. When we were considering moving
to Margate, we were quite disappointed
that there wasn't a doughnut shop in
Margate store. Happy to have a donut
shop in Margate. I second the powdered
covered lemon fil donuts uh, request and
my eight grandchildren will be very
happy that we have a donut shop in town.
>> Okay, motion carries. Nine in favor and
zero opposed. Good luck.
>> Thank you. Good luck. Good luck. Look
>> forward to it.
>> We have cinnamon or cinnamon roll.
>> We have anything else?
>> Oh, they got to be cinnamon. Cinnamon
roll.
>> Okay, we got one more thing. So,
>> okay.
>> Okay.
[laughter] Well, we're we're moving at a
record pace here, so let's uh
>> You're welcome.
>> Let's finish up.
>> Go ahead.
>> Did we adjourn
>> or no? Okay.
>> Just one additional thing is the uh
master plan site committee subcommittee
has met.
>> Is everybody uh listening?
>> I shared some of the uh past master
plans that are consultant that we're
considering.
>> I might ask for a proposal and
>> wait. Hey guys, Chris
can Yeah.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> The uh [clears throat] I I asked him to
come to our next meeting to do a
presentation
to the whole planning board prior uh
Rich Jim. Oh, okay.
>> Again, he's doing the master plan in
Metner, Longport, Summers Point. We're
right here, too. He's well aware of the
new flood regulations that the state has
mandated. I think that's going to be an
important aspect of our master plan.
The rest of it we can dictate, but
again, having his his set of eyes on it,
his familiarity with Atlantic County,
with what's going on, I think is an
asset. Uh
again, I hope we have another meeting
prior to the next meeting to discuss
some things that we need to discuss, but
that that's where we stand. I want to
get that rolling. Um
these these new DP
>> come to a regular board meeting.
>> Yes.
>> Good.
>> Yes. I want it on the record.
>> Yeah.
um these New Jersey impact uh real
rules, the packed rules are going to
have a significant effect
>> in our area.
>> And my my concern is right off the bat,
it has been and is the D wants to review
basically every application and they
don't have the manpower to do what
they're receiving now. So, it's either
going to kill development down here or
it's going to make a six-month project
three years. They want to review every
project.
>> They want to review
>> before Yeah. before we look at them.
They they every application like
>> not just ours. I mean, every
>> everything.
>> So, basically like like the beachfront
homes that require a tapper permit. Now,
you're saying pretty much everything.
>> Everything. We're in a total we're in a
flood zone
>> all across the state. in the coastal
areas. Coastal areas. Yes.
>> Well, that's crazy.
>> That's ridiculous.
>> And what it's you know the the big
effect is and I think I mentioned this
before is the the height of the
buildings. I don't see a big impact in
that we
>> all the homes that we are approving that
I approved that the ordinance approved
we saw this coming five six years ago.
So we let that's why we allowed the
parking below because if we allowed that
just about nine out of 10 applications
come in for that they will be compliant
with the new rules,
>> right?
>> And what the state is doing versus what
FEMA is doing. FEMA maps aren't going
away. They're just use they're
overlaying the FEMA maps like uh the
house tonight was in the flood zone
elevation 10. That's the base flood
elevation. What and we require 3T of
freeboard the bottom of the floor. We'll
give you another foot. that it's 14.
What the state's going to do is that
base flood elevation of 10, the new base
flood elevation is going to be 14.
>> Wow.
>> Plus one foot of freeboard. So we might
have to add a foot for the helms that
aren't having parking below. So we could
look at it two ways. We can some people
every house is going to have parking
underneath basically. That's that's
what's going to happen. And if you look
down south, like North Carolina's had
their own set of rules for flood damage
prevention for long before that we in
New Jersey have had it. There's a more
severe where if you're all those houses
that you see on the TV falling into the
ocean, obviously [snorts] you can't
rebuild those. You have to mitigate
back. But um but if you look down there,
all the homes are up.
>> Mhm.
>> Everywhere. Charleston, South Carolina,
Florida, uh, Outer Banks, Georgia, Jacko
Island, they're all elevated. We're
going to see that here, but there I I
think what we're seeing here is in a
different element what we're seeing down
there. I think the homes up here look a
lot better.
>> Mhm.
>> And we're still going to look at the
idea of
>> creating that space in the ground floor
to And again, I I'm always looking at
doing things that that are passive. We
shouldn't have to exert a lot of energy
to make sure that people are in
compliance year after year after year.
Long court wants to inspect every house
every year on that ground floor. To me,
that's counterproductive.
>> What if you find somebody doing
something wrong? What are you going to
do? You're going to get the city in a
lawsuit and so if we take some of that
area away, it's going to happen. But if
we can reduce it, make it more passive,
I I think we'll be better off. There's
my
>> two cents in a donut.
>> Well, we definitely don't want to see
those houses just up on stilts.
>> No,
>> you drive through Sea Aisle.
>> Talk to the microphone. We're still in
the record.
>> Drive through Sea Aisle and just look
what you see as far as the house on
stilts. That's not what we want Margate
City to look like. That's for sure. It's
so I I I think we're going to go over
and I I think there's going to be
a compromise and and I also [snorts]
would be curious to see
when we have the master plan, we're
going to have public input,
you know, and I'd like to see what they
have to say about that.
>> To that point, Mr. Chairman,
Come on.
>> With Mr. Rotell coming to a meeting, a
full meeting, we're going to advertise
that he's coming so people know and they
can hear. And maybe
>> he's not going to do a presentation what
the master plan's going to be. He's
going to do a presentation on the
process
for the planning board.
>> Yeah, it'll be on the agenda. It
definitely be on the agenda, right? And
there'll be an explanation what's going
on and and plus we're announcing it
tonight ahead of time and there are
people listening. No, trust me people
listen to that's the next meeting.
>> Yes. February uh 28th or
>> 26th
>> 16th.
>> Okay good.
>> Do we have already have cases scheduled
for the
>> Yes.
>> How many?
>> Nine. [laughter]
>> I said I'll take another extra half
hour. Right.
So far, we probably I don't know. We
just got a boatload of standard might
not
>> probably like four or five.
>> Okay.
>> But again, you know, tonight we had five
and I I thought they're basic
applications,
>> right?
>> The major site plan. They're they're the
doozies.
>> Yep. So, [snorts]
>> yeah, I did I I saw this is the same guy
who gave me the uh Yeah, this he's he's
good.
>> Yeah, he's good. Yeah, he he doesn't put
a lot of fluff into it. He just kind of,
you know, talks a little bit about the
community, but then gets right.
>> He's not an attorney.
>> No,
>> he can do it in fewer words,
>> right?
>> No, he he's very strong in GIS and
statistics. He's going to outlay the the
population trends.
>> Yeah.
>> All Atlanta County, Margate, the B,
Epsican Island.
>> He's going to tell us everything that we
know, but it's going to be in black and
white.
>> Yeah. So,
>> and again, I think that the example that
you the board showed tonight on
protecting our commercial businesses,
that's a that's a big one,
>> right? That's strong. And uh from a
zoning standpoint, from a enforcement
side of it, I do whatever I can to help
these businesses,
>> right? And this guy from what I read
like I read the one he did for Ventner
and I think um was it Stone Arbor and
yeah he's very
his tilda is very pro businesses
>> you know and how how you can reserve
that. So I think he's good just from
what I've seen.
>> Is that right? Uh just uh something else
that came up is the the other gas
station that tore down.
>> Was that a sunnies?
>> Sunny's
>> that's that was a subdivision that was
approved with a use fairance to go to
four residential units.
>> Right.
>> That use fairance carries over, but that
subdivision has to come back.
>> So I imagine we'll be seeing that in the
near future. Okay.
>> They never filed it, so it expired.
>> Somebody else buy it.
>> Yes.
Okay,
it is what it is, right?
>> It is what it is. And also, we had a
byight subdivision
subcommittee the other when was that?
Friday, a week ago.
>> Friday.
>> And again, a byite subdivision is minor
subdivision, no more than two lots, two
new lots where the area and the lot
width can comply. There's nothing else,
no other data. There's no house shown on
there. So if the house itself needs
bearings, they they got to come back.
But there's not too many by right
subdivisions here. But I just want to
get that on the record, too. Just to
make you aware, this way was I had to
put two houses there.
>> Did it create a potential hardship?
What?
>> No. No, that wouldn't be my right.
Right.
>> You're talking about Huntington Avenue.
That's
>> okay. Amen. That's it. We're good.
>> Well, the hardship on the Huntington
Avenue one is self-induced with the
pool.
>> Yeah.
>> Right.
>> Which case are we talking about?
>> Two.
>> That was the pool on the corner of
>> Huntington and 300 block.
>> Right near the ball fields.
>> Okay. Across
>> from Duke. Kmar.
>> Kmar and Huntington.
>> Oh. Uh, Leveries.
Yeah.
>> Yeah. Okay. [laughter]
All right.
>> We have a date with him in about 10
minutes, too. So, we just [laughter]
>> Anyway, all right. Motion to adjurnn.
>> Motion. Second.
>> Second.
>> All in favor?
>> All right.
>> You need any of this stuff?