City Council Meeting Dec 20 2022

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foreign
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falling down
absolutely
good evening everyone the purpose of the
executive session tonight is attorney
Klein privilege and that is a
contraction negotiation
I believe we'll be here
I need a motion to go into a second
session motion motion exactly
all in favor
aye
now we're in an executive session um
as the um
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um
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thank you
guys
good evening all city council
um city council summation of executive
session doing executive session City
councils discuss matters regarding
contract associations and that is
related to public Professional Services
the city council decision will be made
available to the public at our
reorganization meeting scheduled for
January the 4th 2023 at 6 p.m Health
organisms
all right
agenda review first on the agenda is
number 24 second reading public hearing
will be held during regular session uh
providing the execution of a financial
agreement on the long-term tax extension
law but the redeveloper for the
Redevelopment area known as block one
I'm sorry lot one block 255 on the tax
plan yeah
resolution 199 creating a current
account temporary budget for 2023
questions
resolution 200 creating a sewing utility
temporary budget for 2023.
resolution 201 authorized the
implementation of a corrected action
plan for the 2021 annual order
any questions
yes
um
action plan it came from the audit
correct yes and
um
Mr chair did you sit down with
um Administration to go over this to go
to come up with them and the reason why
I'm asking because it just says whereas
it is the desire of the city council of
the city of Pleasantville to ensure the
operations of the city are monitored and
inefficient I mean effective and
efficient manner to benefit the citizens
of the city
and I know this is I guess it went you
all talked about it in committee
attached is the representation
and so the resolution is the governing
body has reviewed the recommendations
correct you're letting the state know
that you reviewed it by resolution
approvements
so my question is this is the corrective
action plan and I was just wondering if
the president said with you well you
know mayor and ba to go over this plan
or was it being committee
neither I think a whole castle was it
was explained that a corrective action
plan had to be put in place for our
finance department and that's what we've
done and it was only one finding so the
action plan did specify to that one
issue so it's not a comprehensive plan
of City auditing so this is one
correction that we spoke about how it
needed to be corrected corrected and
that's what we have reported to that
okay it's just that the Verge to me is
like I'm just trying to get an
understanding like it says
um to ensure the operations of the city
are monitored but monitored by whom the
CFO the VA the mayor us all of us are
responsible right so that is the
standard language for the resolution for
the the audit itself but as a council
you're responsible this is why you have
finance committee meetings for you to
review the finances of the city this is
not talking about the finances this is
specifically talking about the findings
that was founded through the audit
process which we've come up with the
corrective action plan that is used for
you today
um
did we somewhat discuss this in a
binding
council meeting at you know before he
got you all I know we discussed the
cities all day but it was just this
corrective action plan like this is new
to me and it's just that this verbiage
and you're saying that this is the verb
is that you know expanded the standard
verbally so it's just that this isn't I
mean this doesn't sit right here
I mean I I don't know how else to
express it
yeah
I mean what was your reason because
it really had nothing to do with putting
this together correct but it says city
council and I think that's what you're
saying because if we vote on this
tonight then now we're at home
accountable for whatever findings or not
not I'm sorry not find this but we're
held accountable for anything that
happens in the future it's not about
what happens in the future it's about
the corrective act action finest right
that one finding right you all as a
council we spoke to you about what
they're finding is we're required by the
state to come up with a plan each time
there's a finding we came up with the
corrective action plan for the finding
which is before you today
um so I'm not really sure are you I'm
not really sure what
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is found for us
that they thought there were certain
areas that we needed correctionally you
know what this correction action plan is
mirroring what they want us to do
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my conversation with the auditor based
on what defining what's in any audit and
we do a corrective action plan and yes
we will follow their recommendation and
make sure that these things are taken
care of
and we will take care of that
and we understand what they say we will
look at and we will take care
what's your I think what council is
looking at is proving it yes they looked
at correct to active plan they expect
the CFO an Administration to take care
of the planet
to take care of the timing the finding
that was that was found in New York
and this is how we're going to take care
of it from what I read this correctly
action plan yeah just just expect that
we expect to take care of it that way
yes
but doing what the owner has suggested
in bouncing the general ledger and all
the other accounts that they that have
to be taken care of so it's not saying
that it's being corrected
in a plan to correct it and you guys
have okay are looking at the plan
okay
next uh resolution 202 approved in the
sale of property known as block 135
block 8 and 19.02 also known as
172-186 North Main Street and 184 North
Main Street and the amount of 220
thousand dollars
any questions
resolution 203 approved in the cell
properly known as Glock 290 Lot 29 also
known as 145 East Delilah Road and
another 82 500.
resolution 2 -4 approving the sale
probably known as 95 lot 20 also known
as 11 Clinton Avenue in the amount of 5
500.
resolution 202 203 204 and 205 we're all
priority on properties that went through
the auction process
um so the first two 202 and 203 we
believe that the bid amount is
sufficient and correlates with the
assessment of the properties however
when you get to resolution 204 and 205
the bid amount is fifty five hundred
dollars those properties are assessed
above that amount so my question to
council today before you take into
consideration is this something that you
want uh the city of pool today or do you
want to sell it today at the recommended
big big price the 11 Clinton Avenue and
the amount of fifty five hundred dollars
is currently assessed at twenty two
thousand dollars so let's start there
it's like giving it away
same with 205. yeah I'll give you those
amounts when I get to it but let me give
you 204 first and I'll yield to the park
against uh City solicit as to how you
determine whether you should pull a
table and resend it back to auction but
I want to make sure that you know what
the assessment amount is
so 205 and 16 Cambria Avenue the
recommend the big amount from the
auction is 6500 the assessment about
amount is seventeen thousand two hundred
dollars
again
with that being said I'm going to give
you the motion to take the motion a
second for the record table and
resolution 204 and 205.
Ship by David four and seven
amazing
if we do a roll call for this one
you want to do it now or
something okay okay uh by Council we're
going to be doing this at the regular
meeting so who will be motion
but as of now expected to be table
how do we put these back up
and see if we can get the assessed value
up yeah we'll probably um
put a minimum requirement down because
this first time we denied because now
that we know what they're trying to
purchase it for we'll put a minimum
amount so that at least we can get the
assessment amount
is the auction only once a year or no
how often you guys to turn it to be that
was our first time around and we did
pretty good
questions
resolution
206 206 authorizing the mayor and city
council to execute an agreement with the
county of Atlantic Municipal Alliance
grant program
questions
residential 207 authorizing submission
of application for the New Jersey
Department of Human Services Division or
mental health and addiction addition
Addiction Services grant funding
I know any questions
resolution 208 support for a suitability
of cannabis business equality cannabis
LLC
questions good question do we have
someone here from this company
I don't know if there's any
representation today from equality
candidates LLC
no representation here today but this is
a micro business
um and as you know with the state law is
that basically we're municipality does
not have jurisdictional reminding
businesses if you allow campus into town
as long as these businesses in a
qualified zoning area in this business
is
um did they pay the application yes
ma'am none of them micro businesses will
come before you without the applicable
application fee in place
okay
did anyone from Council houses
I'm sorry
did I oh no I thought you said something
no when I say something I don't know
anything about them okay did anyone from
Council no
is an application process
um again you can see me unfortunately
because you allow canvas in your town
you don't have jurisdiction over the
micro applications as long as it meets
the state qualifications and meet your
zoning requirements so the application
came in to the city was reviewed
accordingly their application is in with
the state they have a conditional
license based on their resolution being
passed tonight it's just that
um previously we had the two they came
in front of us so I just
like somebody
I'm done
next resolution 209 for God for Budget
transfer for 2022 procreations in the
school fund
any questions
resolution 210 provided for Budget
transfers for 2022 appropriations of the
current price
resolution 211 adopted and certified to
update and review of various sections of
the Personnel policies and procedures
foreign
ERS council meeting
um
most of the ones that are on the top
were omitted or we just kind of
pressure I mean
kind of move forward to fade them so
they wouldn't be delinquent
uh professional Comcast one they were
calling me when they were here was it
just hadn't been processed so we
processed that
under the wire transfer there was a
small debt uh that's a note for the
township was losers held
then we have payroll 725 000 from the
last campus payroll
and then you'll see one for a hundred
thousand under thirty thousand they were
transferred made from the city current
fund one uh 30 000 maintenance of the
city General Capital fund part of the
budget and then the other hundred
thousand dollars was made into what we
call
the compensated balances fund which we
can use to offset some of the expenses
when people retire right now we're just
hundred thousand in there we only have
like 200 000 in there we try to put
money in there every year uh but because
the tightness of the budget is so hard
and move money over so we uh you're
supporting the budget this year that we
knew people were going to start retiring
we want to put money aside kind of like
a saving for uh it doesn't come out of
the budget when people do retired will
come out of this fund so the West Winds
of Township what was that
West Windsor Township and the one
happened oh yeah there's a small desk
some of the townships will be a small
Bond or small a bunch of Suspicion notes
or body Council will offer them out to
forbid
and West Windsor Township this was I
believe some something from four years
ago where we bought some information or
things for the police department and
their vehicles it was like 120 130 000
distributes will pay off that final one
what is West Windsor Township gave us
the numbers that were better than anyone
else
be looking to you know looking for bills
that
looking to be approved tonight
um
on the first page if they ever again
this is police training which I've been
training for the police department of
thousand dollars
you'll see some AE stone for patch dry
patch and cold patch every year for the
roads
if you go over phase two
quarters of the way down you'll see some
Cooper Levinson builds they vary
anything from some labor law to the
regular operating count the 17th 13 000
or for the month of November and halfway
through Bluetooth December 10th and then
we have uh some escrow buildings as well
as we bring internet for P and D this is
your individual billing for for Planning
and Development Council
um
let's see
if you look on page three
halfway down to the everbridge
this is software used by our Police
Department
for some of their operations
um and that's the last one that page 24
000 that was this was kind of reading it
back in September for the Shi to to
supply all the computer operations uh
inside of a carton the computer the
whole nine yard wall there just it's
expensive it's like six thousand dollars
per per vehicle there's four of them
there's four I guess
foreign
monthly contribution to the school board
of 814 000.
if you want to go over these text you'll
see uh
poster and Triple R Lighting as we've
opened down Main Street you'll see the
latest
this is the money it was put out by The
Neighborhood Improvement program and
this will be here this is the second
half of the payment
um I don't know if Christina but I think
they look outstanding I think most of us
I've driven up and down Main Street to
take a look at it
and then the last few months on page six
going into page seven we have a plan we
have a medical opt-out for employees if
they're opting out of our medical
insurance
they can get up to up to
25 of the normal cost so maximum of five
thousand dollars but that's only if they
opt out and their staff did not have
state health benefits if you're if we
have to take health benefits and the
spouse or state health benefits they get
no out that money
but if if I was covered by Aetna and my
wife had State health benefits I went to
State health benefits I would get
dropped out because it's not safe
the maximum of five thousand dollars
maximum of 25 percent of the fall or
five thousand dollars whatever the
smaller numbers so you'll see some 2 900
hours so 5 000 because coverage of
apparent child or just a single purpose
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reactions
so these payouts for the insurance
we got five thousand dollars is five
percent so it would be 25 25 or 5 000
whatever the small number is so is it a
savings to the city oh absolutely okay
because the founder coverage for the
city is close to thirty thousand dollars
okay and do they submit anything for
reimbursement well we know that we know
if they're on on the internet because we
look at the buildings and after real
estate health benefit buildings and you
also send something to HR and yes I am
covered and there's proof of coverage
elsewhere
um
I just have a question on resolution 207
not a question but
um resolution 207
at the bottom it says City Council on
this sixth day of June 2022 so I guess
that's the type of yeah okay
we're portions
here
but the portion we just finished the
building
items only
agenda with the exception of 24 to 44.
um okay
thank you
oh no it's not only
I really don't need it anyway
um
I'm going to speak on the pilot which is
on the agenda and Mr President it may
not sound like that as I can start but
that I want to build some Foundation
please
I may take a little more time
the way the measure on it right you can
wait
my name is for those that don't know me
simply it's Bill Christmas as the
holidays come
I am very proudly spent
approximately 45 of them serving the
city in many different capacities
planning board school board and I spent
12 years on City Council
you might think
I will say it first
I am positive on the pilot you might say
to yourself well he was on city council
I stood in this very same spot and spoke
against the sewage
so it isn't that like the old voice says
to be support
the foundation
for the pilot
number one is we have a very good City
here
I don't know if you folks really really
know how to go to town you really have
we're lifted with the city with the
state as one of the 15 cities on the
move
we carry an excellent bond rate
that's why we can get the bonding like
we do
we have a lot of developments
moving into the tank for you folks that
don't know it how many here know what's
going up on waiting toward the trees all
down where the old Campground was
between Walgreens and Popeyes
do you know what's going in there
did you see it mod wash car wash very
very modern upscale car wash
people want to do business in
Pleasantville
now let's talk about the business they
want to do in Louisville
we're having Christmas season coming now
many of you and all of us are going to
the stores to buy
Best Buy Walmart
but what are they doing to get you to
come there
they got a sale on this they got a
coupon on that to get you to come to
their business and do business
how in the world this pilot ever got
started I don't know
whether it was the cities or the
property people
the
developers would want to come in I don't
know but it's here this pilot is here
and these Developers
if you're not going to offer them
something
they're going to go to the town that
offers the first the pilot
is the same deal if you don't give a
little you're not going to get anything
now let's talk about what you get
with the amount of taxes that they will
pay at the low end of course you know
this is a rising scale 30 years long by
the way but this is a rising scale they
keep paying more
the first three years is approximately a
million dollars
in the bank vaulters for the city in our
pocket by the time you get to 15 years
it's a multitude of million dollars that
they're going to pay
the bottom line folks is
ninety percent of a pie is better than
nothing
thank you
oh again
good evening everyone
my name is Tim Jones presidential
resident
and I heard my comments so it shouldn't
take long
now it would be erroneous to think my
concerns are against development in the
city
I believe this project could benefit the
city greatly my concern is fundamentally
one of tax fairness
and the agreement between Sprite glass
and the City of Pleasantville it says
paraphrasing the annual service charges
and newer real property taxes allows
maximum development excuse me
College the importance
okay can I continue
okay
the annual service charges and those
real property taxes allow maximum
development of property and is therefore
in the best interest of the city
that's also an application but then I
refer to the master plan the 2008 master
plan and it says that the city has
determined that land such as the old
Pleasantville High School site if sold
and developed the area could provide the
city with much needed funds in the form
of purchase price as well as our ongoing
revenues in the form of significant tax
rateables the master plan also says as a
principal to utilize all the tools and
Powers available for the city to support
not just create economic development in
Pleasantville the the master plan States
and objective is to generate new tax
rateables and maximize tax revenue by
returning to productive use lands which
are currently unutilized which is what
we have on our day Friday however this
30-year tax abatement how does this
30-year tax abatement maximize and
provide significant tax rateables when
we don't receive them or receive 25
percent of what we otherwise should get
over that 30-year period that's the
question I would like to ask
how is it maximizing our tax revenues
when we're giving away 75 percent of the
revenue last weekend
I don't get it
anyone have an answer
yeah
there's a public hearing um in the
regular meeting and we'll make sure that
every project answer most of your
questions there so if you can just
present your questions and your comments
here and then the public hearing will
try to answer most of them thank you
thank you
good evening everyone
I just had a few questions on a
different audience a resolution
um for resolution 200 creating a
sewer utility temporary budget is that
standard
so you do it every year
in order to do that we have to have a
budget by January 1st otherwise we have
we can't operate it so
we set up a temporary budget for sewer
as well as current Fund in order to pay
a bills after January 1st are they in
tandem when you do those budgets no the
current funds we do the temporary budget
but they're two individual individual
budgets
and as far as ordinance number 24
um do you have
the um
do you have the forecasting model
the pilot forecasting model
does anyone have the forecasting model
for ordinance number 24. I think we can
go over there in our public hearing is
there a copy here
the city has the information is there
copies available to the public today
probably not but we'll try to answer
your questions and get the documents to
you according I'm just I'm just making
sure you you the city conducted a
forecasting model yeah if we're talking
about projections and all of that I know
those words are interchangeable yes you
did okay and you said like how long like
within seven days well I believe once
the information and I'm guilty right the
solicitor for that but
so right now going into the draft form
so any negotiations still subject to
returning clients and it's not such a
solution once it's belief that it'd be
subject to public so there was a
forecasting model conducted
to say that there was a projection of
payments for the future no no no not
like the company gave y'all what the
city did yeah we that's why I asked the
CFO we had to keep the numbers done
that we have done that work and actually
it's based on what we wanted to see them
pay us and what they've agreed to Across
the events I mean we can broadcast we
can do any kind of projection you want
and we want a million dollars a year
but you're not going to pay a million
dollars here the rejection is based on
their interest data revenue and what we
see and whether it's agreeable or not
according to the state model
our individual model I don't know what
state does what we do okay
leaving yes
council president
s of public comment during President
Council meetings was I guess directed by
the attorney and it states each speaker
will have a maximum of three minutes to
speak
that's what he says black and white from
the city of attorney
in reference to
the pilot program there's a section
number four zero 4.03 annual service
charge amount
there's also
uh
Spyglass residential I would call it a
spreadsheet it speaks about the product
program for 30 years according to the
paperwork it says for uh year one the
equal amount shall be zero
that's right so far you too it states
and amount equal to eighteen hundred
dollars
when the spreadsheet has nothing
year three let me back up for a second
eighteen hundred dollars times eight
hundred units is 224 000 that's under
the column year three
okay
um
year three the amount let me back up
year two of the amount is nineteen
hundred dollars nineteen hundred dollars
times 180 units is three hundred and
forty two thousand dollars that's year
two
that's in column three
it's the paperwork from the primary
proposal I guess whatever you want to
call it year three it says 200 I'm sorry
two thousand dollars per presidential
unit that's year three year three on
here I'm sorry year three times two
thousand
one data units is 360
000.
360
000 is under column year five got
discrepancy going on year four an amount
equal to twenty one hundred dollars per
residential unit
uh that's four times okay 2100 times 180
units 378 thousand dollars 378
000 for year four is on the column year
six we got this crimson
next question
uh interesting conversation in the last
meeting in reference to why is it that
according to the urban renewal entities
disclosure information section one type
says original certification section two
states uh the project right now so forth
section three had to check column with
new housing units I looked at them
online I heard the gentleman's
explanation
um it didn't really set too well with me
um It also says if you check the boxes
one to two you section four and six
section four mistakes Redevelopment plan
information the housing project right he
has total numbers of units in it doesn't
apply okay then it says go back again if
you did one until you go to section 607
okay six says
the project is a new construction that's
all I said so going back to the main
point if it says units should be
checking units aren't checked then if
you get an explanation why is my check
and he says based on some law or
whatever might be or some reason or
where we do business but it's not in
black and white that's not sound
when you're doing business that's not
sound
next thing I'm talking fast because I
only got three minutes
just something president named
Scarborough as a sign of redeveloper
earlier this year now this goes back
with um what Twitter was involved
Scarborough has since turned its over to
spy glass so we have right now the
president LLC and in-house company as
part of it interesting agreement
Pleasantville will work with Ocean City
and accept 70 000 cubic yards of clean
so you drinks from the great Egg Harbor
Bank tweeting says Pleasantville will
use the soaring to build up the old High
School site by Firefly to make it
suitable for redevelopment Ocean City
will pay Pleasantville 5.95 million
dollars to accept the soil but president
must pay the money to scarf Scarborough
which is handling the dredging thank you
it's very interesting
um Can someone answer what I have set up
a hundred thousand miles an hour
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can anyone answer
Ed really fast I don't know I'm not
going to try to answer it in the public
hearing for you okay just one question
on that why are we answering the problem
normally we always answer stuff
according to items yeah because because
there is a public hearing for this
specific item and that's where you
really do the Q a but yeah I need to
understand it so you can correct me this
the public can't always been after we
did the um line items the public I'm
sorry I put using line items you
understand what I'm saying like if it's
nothing too all you guys need to say
about number two we spoke with number
two we got an answer but we were the
public portion that was something
totally different you talk about the
moon sometimes if you want to yeah
because you're you're talking about an
ordinance rather than a resolution so
when there is a second reading on the
ordinance there is a public hearing for
that particular or is at your side and
that's only on the second reason that's
why we're going through this yeah so Mr
President are we three minutes be good
right are you Pastor first no no but I'm
just saying the previous according to it
thank you okay
okay three minutes everybody you need to
hear this man
thank you
good evening good evening evening
at the last meeting
I posed a question to the council
regarding who would have sword the
financial responsibility in the event
that the company that belly up was this
thoughtful deadly problem or whatever
and the council president said it would
be their responsibility
I would have been inclined to believe
that but because I know
that there's particulars that have been
misrepresented I looked it up myself
so it says this council president no
they're not responsible for it it says
the company is subject to the provisions
with respect to Pleasantville now this
is a provision that Pleasantville is
going to give the company
uh they're going to give them to
alleviate any Financial burdens this is
what Pleasantville is going to do in
case it has any type of financial
difficulties
and this is if they have a result of
mismanagement
a result of mortgage foreclosure
fiscal legal or managerial misconduct
Pleasantville is going to assume the
responsibility with the local Finance
board to assume the responsibility of
this company this is in this is in the
contract
this is in the contract that you said
they would assume the responsibility so
my question is
why should the taxpayers
be the ultimate insurers
of a financial company of a company of
this magnitude if they have any
Financial uh uh uh uh problems
why are we assuming the cost it says it
in the contract that Pleasantville
will assume that they are allowing this
provision now I understand I've heard Mr
Christmas
I am not against
the project
but I am against
multi-million dollar companies coming in
and paying no taxes
they're paying less than a half a
million dollars
on a 40 million dollar profit on a 40
million dollar income
that doesn't make sense to me
it just doesn't make sense and then
we're offering Mr Christmas that we got
to give something well it looks like
we're giving everything
we're we're giving them a tax rebatement
if if it fails we're going to give them
we're going to ensure that they're not
we're going to assume their
responsibility that's what it says in
the contract
why are we ensuring them
why are we yet giving them something
else
and what are we going to get besides
higher taxes because we have to support
the multi-million dollar countries
help me
If any man lacks wisdom let us ask I
like wisdom on this can somebody help me
business administrator
the mayor I'm just telling you this is
in the contract
the rich get richer and the poor gets
raped
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and our council president said
when I asked the question he says they
will
did you read this no does anybody have a
copy for the council for the council
president to read
because he's told me straight up Stay
With Me and I remember because you were
quite that they will
they won't
Pleasantville will
all of my fellow residential people
we're gonna carry that burden
if there's a if there's another Sandy
who's going to re who's gonna who's
gonna absorb the expense we are
we're already over taxed I believe
Pleasantville is all that in a bag of
chips like Mr Christmas said
somebody's got to pay for it
is anybody going to answer my question
or this has to be deferred to the
question answered team too so all of the
questions
um lead to this ordinance is going to
we're going to try to address them at
the public hearing session
that's going to be advertised no no
today oh okay we have to go through the
regular this is this is the work session
once we get permanent work associations
yeah okay so this is the work session
once we get to the work session and go
into the regular meeting the clerical
call public comments for uh this item
and then we'll try to get these
questions and answered for you guys
tonight okay okay thank you
yeah
Urban Moreno Rodriguez
Pleasantville New Jersey
thank you city council president for the
time but I just have a question was
there a tax abatement expert that was
used to go over this paperwork
to properly
manage his paperwork to tell you exactly
what's going to happen with his tax
abatement program
has any expert on taxes or economic
welfare have they been consulted for
this project
we believe that our our professionals
that we have in place this is not the
first
um pilot or tax abatement that the city
has looked at so we do have
Professionals in place to look at these
items so it's not a discretionary
Council and others but we have
Professionals in place
but when they those professionals be
considered experts on tax abatement
programs in New Jersey I would things to
say that they have quite a bit of
experience and the knowledge to uh to to
look at these agreements
experience is great but I'm talking
about experts because I guess my
following question would be
um if has plausible gone into previous
pilot agreements yes
and have they been successful how have
they been measured
which ones have been successful and
which ones have not been successful
I think that is a question that is not
for this forum because it depends on
what you believe as being successful I
certainly agreed with well I'm I want
you and the mayor to tell me which ones
have been successful or the city
they've been successful and how do you
measure that success
particularly about this ordinance um as
I spoke to others we're going to try to
answer your questions on the public
hearing okay because as I'm sitting in
the audience and I wasn't planning on
speaking but as I'm sitting in the
audience this is essentially a gamble
with taxpayer funds
and I'm I I just want some proof I just
want some expertise I want someone to
sit down and talk to the public and say
look these pilot programs work
because I'm not an expert so and I
understand that this may have to go to q
a but
you know where is the evidence that
pilot programs have worked in New Jersey
you say you have experts that have
reviewed these tax abandonment programs
but can someone bring me an expert from
state government to tell me that these
tax pilot work programs have worked
where's the research here give me one
research paper that has shown that these
Tyler pilot programs have worked that's
all I'm asking for
me I don't know that the state would
have something in place if they didn't
think that it worked so that might not
be the right question that gets you
where you're going but if you're the
patient with us to let us get to the
public hearing I think most of your
questions will be answered and then I
don't mean to be rude but there is a
report that was published in 2010 by the
State Comptroller
to the Christie Administration
and at the end of his uh report it
States Tax abatements are often costly
and controversial and are difficult to
implement
cities should seek alternative like
enhancing local infrastructure
creating training
improving local projects local
beautification projects instead of
seeking tax abatements so I'm not a tax
abatement expert but I went to The
Experts and this stuff is published
online and free for anybody to look up
so I really hope I keep coming to the
city council meeting and asking for your
advice and your input and to see if
you've reached out to any Scholars or
experts because I'm not an expert but I
hope this research would have been done
before you sit down and vote on it
because the research is there
pilot programs have not worked in the
state of New Jersey and you're going to
vote on another one tonight
please don't listen to me listen to The
Experts thank you
anyone else
good evening Council
um David Carrington
um
back in
September 1st
2020
also known as the final hearing
at that time Mr Genetti had explained
that the property
that is located
is in uh opportunity Zone
which will allow the developer to
provide a market rate rental units and
commercial space
and create maybe create perhaps
the highest radical in the city once
developed okay
um according to the IRS
the IRS the irs's website
opportunity zones offer tax benefits to
investors who elect
to temporarily defer tax on capital
gains
if they timely invest those games those
gain amounts in a qualified opportunity
fund qof
okay my question is how
do the tax benefits
to the developer benefit the youth
benefit the senior citizens
benefits this city
how does it benefit the youth
how does it benefit how would this
benefit
the developers benefit how would it how
would it benefit okay our senior
citizens
the city of Pleasantville how's it going
to benefit
if you go into this deal how is it going
to benefit
I think the chair is pointing to me to
repeat the same thing that I've been
saying these are excellent questions and
we are I hope that we're taking notes so
that we can try to get more during the
public hearing so it'll be answered at
that time
tonight yes
okay
final answer
okay
[Music]
um
because
um this is a little disgusting
what is it that we can talk about now
that we can get a response to because I
remember being at a school board meeting
when the same thing happened when they
were instructed not to talk to parents
and they were instructed not to talk to
the people answering questions and this
is what I it looks like I'm looking at
and I don't like it
yeah so we're in a work session so this
is typically what happens we go over the
agenda and then we allow right after the
work session
public portion for agenda items the
difference between an ordinance and a
resolution is that an ordinance by law
has two readings of which the first bill
is called the last meeting on December
5th this is the second reading of which
a public hearing happened and during
that time is when we invite the public
to come in and speak about that so
you're not wrong to speak about an
agenda item because ordinance 24 is an
agenda item it just has its own public
so what is as an agenda item but what's
the point of speaking about it is
nobody's speaking back so my other
question is this I'm sorry I don't mean
to question but I want to be rude to
anybody but my ex my other question is
this
tonight y'all did executive session
y'all did interviews we standing out
there in the lobby with nowhere to sit
just standing up
why can't you have your executive
sessions in City Hall in that big
conference room that you got upstairs at
two o'clock in the afternoon and that's
the proper time to interview people so
that when we come over here and I'll
just stay on I get up six o'clock in the
morning every morning to go to work
and then I come home and I don't have
dinner because I'm waiting for y'all to
finish playing games with me like y'all
the cat and I'm the mouse you know
I don't appreciate it I think it's
condescending and I think that you play
in my intelligence Chief and ain't
nothing dumb about me
so I think some some things need to be
changed I don't like this game
be forthright
if you want to do what you want to do
anyway say I'm gonna do what I'm gonna
do anyway
but don't try to treat people like their
children or insignificant and that they
don't matter because our salaries pay
you
mm-hmm
I don't have this kind of time this is
wasteful time and I don't have a lot of
time to waste I have a sick child that I
could be attended to
instead of sitting here being ignored
and treating life and treating like the
dirt on the bottom of your ship
that's all I gotta say I'm over Miss
Brown I have to speak on that please
first of all I apologize to all of you
for having to stand out there that and
in the future we will and I'm saying as
mayor that in the future maybe it should
be us that goes somewhere else when you
are staying here
and then you leave right away but we I
do apologize on behalf of all of us I
feel safe saying that we're not being
insensitive it just wasn't a thought
it's just it just wasn't a thought
tonight and I do appreciate you
appreciation yes but it feels so
degrading I know it but I don't want you
to feel that way that when the dirt on
the bottom of your shoe or anything it
really was just and it was and it was it
just just didn't think of it but we will
in the future
because during the daytime
in the future though we will attempt to
be the ones to leave the room okay for
just don't leave the room have your
meeting at different time because we're
not a partner that has nothing to do
with us you tell us to come out at this
time but then we got to stand out there
for an hour and a half two hours while
you do this that has nothing to do with
us do your thing one or your day and do
our thing on a day that's for us
I'm not trying to be unreasonable I
don't want to be rude I'm not trying to
be ignorant or to anybody I promise you
I don't feel that you are but I I just I
hear what you're saying it's very
inconsiderate
some of us leave children small children
at home
some of us need sick children at home
and we work all day yeah we get it with
some of your children
how about that
okay
good evening council president
I thought this Harmon uh
too I just wanted to dress up more than
24 a little bit
um the issue with the tax debate is uh
it's technically if you want to speak
the property as is is collective revenue
or should be collecting the revenue for
the city in Texas
so it's not up to us as a council to
appease the developer and to give them a
maintenance to build an economy
understand that the city wants
development and new places stuff like
that but it's not up to us to Department
of thought as is for almost less than 10
percent of the
market value of the property
um and then again because you have 180
homes for coming in you gotta look at 25
000 now the child to educate so we have
to look at that spreads coming to the
city
um also looking at part of 1880 homes
say two thousand dollars
a piece and property tax that's uh
260 000 a year Revenue we're missing out
and for 30 years abatement that's like
10.8 million dollars
to be giving away but potentially for
making that property
um so I just asked the city to make a
table of seven minutes and look into it
look at the value and the cost is going
to cost the city because instead of
the development and the business that's
coming to the city hey the helplessly
get bigger and financially stable you're
going to be costing us it has a taxpayer
that's not acceptable all right thank
you uh holidays
Jerry King Cedar Pleasantville
a former firefighter on that uh good
evening
it's a tough job you guys got
I'd like to speak on the pilot program
real quick a couple of questions and see
what I feel are legitimate concerns
I know you guys pretty much already made
your mind about how you're going to vote
on it
all right and I don't expect you to
agree with me
just want you to think
you use the brain that God gave you I
wrote your conscious
because the Bible says unless a man
striving lawfully he strives in vain
and I brought up some things previously
about legalities about this contract
about realities about the oath that you
guys for to protect and defend the
Constitution against all enemies foreign
to Faithfully execute the duties of your
office
and then you said so help me God
that means something
I just want you guys to contemplate that
because the serious matters at hand
we've talked about the lives of the
residents of this city
and
we don't just like come in here to give
you a hard time you just want to see
things done right
we just want things to be done right
yeah
you know even even in law if something's
done unlawfully that ruling ends up
being null and void
so all the paperwork and all the
documentation and even this gentleman
said to me there's eight other pilot
projects in the city more than all those
to conjecture I said well here in law is
a problem in my eyes that there are
eight other
companies getting tax abatements when
the city is in the red and we need funds
why are we giving these special deals
and he said it to me like it was I
should have been excited
I I don't know I'm not the most
brightest guy in the world but that man
doesn't happen and I just asked you guys
to really look at
I think someone mentioned bring in a
professional to really analyze assess
evaluate and look at the nuts and bolts
of the project
you know I understand there's supposed
to be a project like this is not
supposed to have any negative impact I
understand it has two negative impacts
one are you going to close the street
you're going to close off Randall's food
you're going to close off the harman
boat slip business that's two negative
impacts
how do you lawfully do that
and how can you say it's a good deal
when it violates
these mandates
I just here again
I want you to agree with me I just want
you to think
just think and analyze and assess two
negative impacts not supposed to have
any negative impact
you know is the City attorney here
because I don't know maybe
because you guys are an attorney you're
not expected to know the law but he is
she
's supposed to she's supposed to keep
you straight when you're out alive
but if this gets approved in front of
your watch it's on your headache
and my thing is
you're an officer to state
and officer of the Court
maybe you're not expected to know but
you are
and it's your job to keep them in line
when they're out of line
and that's just
either we're going to do it lawfully or
we're not going to do it at all because
it's like hearsay hearsay is
inadmissible as evidence in a court of
law a lot of this stuff that's been
proper is like proper evidence is
hearsay there's no proof there's no
substance it's like a fugazi it's a
Hoosier it's a fairy dust
and I just I'm just saying hold your
conscious
look at this thing
like your life dependent on it because
ours do
that's right
I reside in 115 year old house
it's not raggedy
but it's old
why are my taxes over five thousand
dollars a year and Rising
when I looked at EHT in a brand new
house my taxes were only six thousand
dollars a year
Ocean City has lower taxes in terms of
actual per capita basis than
Pleasantville why because the business
is paid abroad for the taxes in Ocean
City yeah
and we want to give them
abatements yes
I am not in agreement does it make sense
I'm here as a taxpayer of paying County
and federal taxes
and over here there's a community person
about this concern
of what's going on with this development
New Jersey did a task force on equity
and found out that a lot of developers
have been coming in to
black communities
and haven't been doing their fair share
of what they should be doing that's
right so it's about Solutions right now
my experience of being on the planet was
my experience of being in the community
with boots on the ground and knowing
what's going on
there's a solution that we all can come
together on and that is called Community
benefits agreement
it's something that's state all over the
country
say that you should be involved with and
also I just want to educate you
for those who don't know on some things
on what is a community benefits
agreement
it's an agreement signed by the
community
benefit groups and a development
identify
range of community benefits
the developer agrees to provide is part
of development
what is a community benefits group a
community benefit groups is a coalition
a neighborhood associations Facebook
organizations unions environmental
groups and others coming together
what are some of the benefits for
communities
to obtain Community input
into projects Partnerships between
developers and communities and schools
and commitments that may provide
sustainability sustainability benefits
for the community those are key issues
it's something that is no developer
should deny that they don't want as well
as the government
is suffered from government because it
is the community the people that's going
to be affected the most and it takes the
politics out of what doing right between
our development what do the developer
get out of this I know that's one thing
they want to know
well one thing that developers get
is they they may get their project done
but it will be inclusive and it'd be
fairness and it'd be up equality and to
be transparent everybody wants
government to be transparent
to have a meeting and talk for three
minutes
about the issues that going on right now
it's unfair unless you have a town hall
meeting to talk about it first
but the community benefits agreement
brings about the togetherness of the
unification for the developers so my
question is
because I'm used to just doing
three minutes government is going to be
for the people value
[Music]
so the question is to the developer
and then I'm going to ask the boy the
Council of quest
would you mind who's the developer this
are you alone right now
would you mind tabling this
and until you talk to a community and
talk about Community benefits of me
and we'll go to remote accessible
that's my question to him this community
this is what we talk about congressman
is talking about
would you why have talked about
Community benefits
to there's a conversation about
Community benefits agreement so it could
be transparent and everybody will be
considered have net input to what's
wrong and pleasantly
so my question to council well one of
you mine just told me what's the hurry
bust a hurry you know it's about
communication
thank you
um
now we have open discussions
well
yeah well you know everybody it all
sounds great and a lot of people I've
never seen you know I mean everybody
comes out at the end and we've been
working on this project for 18 years
what I mean you know it's all like
like everybody acts like they've never
heard anything we've been working on
this for 18 years we've never heard of
it so if it just falls apart just so you
understand I guarantee I know there's no
way anybody's ever going to invest 40
million dollars again in this city I
mean it's just ridiculous I mean that
attitude is the problem when you end up
okay
come on man now we went and saw this
project exactly what's going to be built
there it's going to be a showpiece it
will turn the city around
excuse me
Davenport
Wisconsin
[Music]
city of mississippiville city council
regular meeting Davis 29th today's day
December of 19 2022 the time is
9 9 15.
it has been newly advertised I say the
newspaper and performance
of sunshine
which please stand for application and
the complex
um
foreign
this one
thank you
good evening everyone
after 20 years over 20 years council is
fine this is the glass council meeting
tonight
working with these fans are going to
miss you this is happy Saturday
happy for you that's that for us
okay I have an accommodation to read
this councilman Swan officer mayor city
of Pleasantville accommodation where
Stanley Swan was elected as councilman
of Ward one for the city of
Pleasantville in October of 2000 is
commitment and Leadership throughout
this term expresses the passion he
possessed for the residents of the city
and we're as councilman Swann served as
chairman of the planning and development
Community he is also noted as a
successful business owner for over 40
years of a UEC certified business within
the city of Pleasantville is knowledge
of the industry played a vital and
pivotal role in Economic Development
moreover throughout the years councilman
swan has financially supported annual
community events such as Winter
Wonderland Trunk or Treat Multicultural
Fest and so much more
and where is councilman swans
as generously given to countless
families and partnered with various
local organizations and youth programs
he is a community philanthropist with a
heart with the residents that he serves
now therefore I dream Ward the mayor of
the city of Pleasantville New Jersey on
behalf of the city council the
administration the citizens of
Pleasantville do commend Stanley Swan
for decades of service as councilman of
the city of Pleasantville and do pray
for a health leader and rewarding
retirement
and witness whereof I have set my hand
and cause it's the only city of Pleasant
Hill to fix this 19th day of December
and the year of my authority in 2000.
science community
look my heart is still here with
Pleasant though I I'll do anything I can
make everything work right here and I'm
still gonna I'm gonna build your side
again congratulations
this
is
the family has been a dedicated public
service
a welcome knowledge walks out of here
with him tonight and it's it's sad it's
going to miss you soon congratulations
I will miss you
I will see you around I know where you
live
what's that congratulations
don't let us know you'll always be alone
don't forget all day
[Music]
20 years buddy but it's easier said than
done
22. hey correct me 22. uh we're gonna
miss you but stick around we've got a
lot to do so good job
effects you know I'm not going to miss
you but congratulations
congratulations
of taking care of the classroom
building infrastructure system and
trying to advise everybody come up with
a way to um
march on and and do what's right for the
city of another building yeah
um
[Music]
who's number 24 providing for the
execution of our financial agreement
under the long-term tax exemption law
with the redeveloper for the
Redevelopment area known as lot one and
block 255 on the tax Max in the city
um
okay it's the second reading public
hearing and what they would like to say
anything please come forward state your
name
hi my name's uh Rick Genetti um
I'm with Brook group I am a consultant
to the city on Redevelopment matters not
just this project
um congratulations councilman Swan thank
you nice nice working with you thank you
for having me speak this evening
um I will do my best to answer the
questions the best that I can I wanted
to give this little background
on this project and on the city in
general and and pilot agreements in
general
so the city in 2002 were in 2002
um was designated a city in its entire
entirety you need a rehabilitation
the reason you get that designation is
it's you know one it's a difficult to
develop Community usually old housing
stock old buildings environmental
conditions
um above the average poverty rate in the
town
and it starts to implement State
programs that bring you know I said this
two weeks ago pools in the pool box you
start bringing development to campus
um
this agreement or this site was
um transferred to the city in 1997. it
was the old High School site
built in the early 1900s so it's a
property that for 120
years approximately hasn't paid any
taxes to the city of pleasantly
um so
the city in 2003 under its statutory
rights from the state
in a Redevelopment plan for lace back
the Lakes Bay Area Redevelopment plan is
the start of the tools to redevelop an
area it helps you with zoning
it provides options for these kind of
you know Pilots among other things right
they had multiple developers come in and
show interest in the site I think
somebody had mentioned Toll Brothers
jmf Jack Morris these are all folks who
came in early who couldn't make the
financial plans work by the way as
councilman Swan said in working on this
breaking news
there was proposals on the table
that those developers wanted which
included Pilots but also included direct
payment to the city per unit
direct payments in addition to fire
those were rejected by the city yes so
you know and rightfully so and this
thing sat there was many many developers
who wanted to do affordable housing
there I I met with dozens of them
and uh they would say we want to do
affordable housing we might build ten
thousand or fifteen thousand square feet
of retail but we're going to do low
income housing by its nature low-income
housing the state of New Jersey Works
under a pilot agreement and also works
under a affordable housing pilot
agreement because we'll talk about the
numbers here and I know what you were
saying should be happy the numbers are
on a on a market rate pilot
significantly higher so we're talking a
different set of numbers than when
you're talking about when we did the
Hope six projects
or let the Housing Authority pays on its
cooperation agreement where that caring
pays on it assisted living and Senior
Center where that church pays for its
units
um you know at the old church or that
City Center case
for those four buildings
those were wise developments we asked do
they work do pilots work do we remember
what our city center looked like
prior to this development
and the environmental conditions that
were there the oil tanks and all the
other stuff that had to come out all the
remediation that had to be done having a
lumber yard in your Center City having
Main Street buildings that were falling
apart and were safety hazards so the
Redevelopment there made the city a
better place in a safer place but it
didn't generate as much revenue as to
save in life
okay but he brought in and brought in
rooftops which the rooftops should spend
money in town
and I see a lot of improvements on
family tree I'd like to see more but
Main Street was not as nice
10 years ago okay and it's getting
better as we go so as we go
um
this development has gone through
multiple developers multiple
Redevelopment plan amendments in 2016
after the Great Recession
and after you know other developers were
then
rejected
the city did an Outreach for Developers
we reached out directly to dozens I I
don't know the number I have to look up
but I'm sure it was 40 or 50 developers
and Market it regionally for Developers
Scarborough properties was the
designated developer became designated
in 2017. there was a question about the
dresses
that was in a 2017 or 18 Redevelopment
agreement
which was replaced and amended in 2019.
that agreement with the city of Ocean
City did not work out because the plan
to do that was not approvable by the
Department of Environmental Protection
so that's a document that was replaced
that's that's why that's not not the
case
um it would have been nice if it worked
for the city because the city would have
brought in Revenue part of that Revenue
was going to go to who did the work and
part of that Revenue would have come to
the city that's what would be negotiated
but the New Jersey dep would not allow
that
so it didn't happen we didn't make any
transactions with the city of Ocean City
um
So This Plane as it sits has gone
through several public meetings because
that goes through a Redevelopment plan
amendment in
2019 a new Redevelopment agreement
um
all this was presented at that time
so let's let's look at uh
I guess the one thing just on the taxes
that I think is important and I know we
can always agree to disagree about the
amount
when this pilot
oh by the way it's one of the questions
that was a very good observation and it
came up in the councilman Thomas last
time I believe
the
projection in the application part of
the financial agreement
says too it might have been 12 out of
two years of zero that's reflective of a
year of construction and the first year
lease up
the financial plan picks the years and
the year one starts for each individual
building
when each individual Bill to get to co
that's what's in the agreement
so that's that's what starts it and in
theory you know you look at that pilot
two different ways
you look at those numbers I like to look
at the stabilization number once
everybody's in itself right
so we got it up to twenty one hundred
dollars a unit
378 000 once it's stabilized
at 378 000 a year that'll be the fifth
that project will be the fifth largest
taxpayer to the city of Pleasantville
the fifth largest taxpayer to the city
of Pleasantville this is not a pilot
when I made the comment sir to you
earlier we were talking about Pilots
when you add up the four buildings at
City Center the two projects that hope
six the two building higher the
high-rise and mid-rise of the senior
buildings in the Housing Authority
Karen's building and the church
they pay 600 units approximately 20 000
square feet of retail
they pay it in 2021 they keep three
hundred and three thousand dollars to
see
this project will pay more because it
will be the fifth largest taxpayer for
the city of Pleasantville and by the way
when we take 378 we talk about
um
we talk about the the stabilized period
it's 378 to minimum
can edit must go up every year
it'll go up by either the same amount as
the tax rate in the city the city your
taxes go up by three percent that goes
up by three percent
but if your taxes go down
sounds crazy right but what did they do
it's the long-term agreement if the
taxes on that still must go up by at
least one percent
that's the agreement and by the way
notwithstanding any of the above that I
just said
10 of the revenue gross revenue
is paid to the city
so the Baseline is the 378 000 that goes
up every year that's the Baseline so if
they do a bad job marketing it and they
have the 10 or 12 percent vacancy rate
the city gets 378.
if they do a good job and it's fully
occupied the city will get more
if the project is successful
I mean very successful
because this is a really what I call a
many project this is not just like hey
you got an apartment you live in you
just got all kinds of amenities it's to
draw higher rents in a beautiful
location
if those rents go up
and match what we believe they will go
up by
the payment to the city will go up
accordingly
so if he raises his ranks from 18 or
1900 to 22 or 2300
are are payment to the city goes up
now in addition one of the reasons you
do a pilot for economic development
um that DCA application
granted any every deal with the state I
deal with the state all the time
you follow the instructions they call
this a commercial project
because it's a market rate rental they
call the residential project
residential if their home ownership
project for a low-income housing project
that's why it's called commercial and
the units are not applicable we don't
make the rules the DCA does that
application to the DCA
is so the LLC can be turned into what's
called an urban renewal LLC that's what
makes it eligible that's what that
application is and and that's all that
it is okay that's what it's for because
you have to be an LLC to qualify for the
financial reason and it has to be in an
area and need a Redevelopment which that
area is designated under the state rules
to be an area you need Redevelopment it
has been in 2003.
um so that's the other thing but one of
the things that residential does because
we're talking about a financial
agreement for the resident
the rest of it is the commercial
the commercial will pay taxes too that's
an addition those are you everyone wants
resident or a commercial because it pays
additional taxes and it's additional
benefit to the city as additional jobs
to the city So the plan is if I'm right
Mr sparkler always two restaurants
um a tiki bar a bakery coffee shop
oh by the way I think 90 parking spots
for the commercial side news parking
sites will be public so people who want
to enjoy the renovated Park and Marina
and fishing dock you can park at that
site and take the walking pass and all
that kind of stuff and use it as a
benefit to the city
um so we get the commercial and
additional Revenue this will pay well
over four hundred thousand dollars a
year probably would be the fourth
highest taxpayer in the city
um so let's look at some of these other
questions
gotta put my glasses on it looks like
this is your name yes can you speak
to one of the comments about
um the potential negative uh impact to
Randall's in the boat slip up a private
homeowner can you tell them what the
that situation is please
um yeah and Sean might have to help me
further but for Randall Randall's right
now has no parking except street parking
parking the city street they actually
actually parked on the city bike path
which is illegal parking
so there's a benefit to Randalls to have
people Park illegally but no one's
saying anything down there
will be right across the street from
Randalls nine parking spaces that
they'll be able to use during the day
for their staff okay and people coming
and going the rest of the benefits to
Randalls is
they they opened up at least door and
covet they start doing a lot more retail
sales not just you know they they were
primarily selling the restaurants
and then during covet they were having
people come into the restaurants were
closed and buy you directly
well you're going to have a heck of a
lot of people coming in here and joining
the the tiki bar and all those kind of
public
facilities
and they're going to have access if I
was Randall's I would have I would
change the front of this building and
have a retail store to make sure and by
the way that would be a benefit to the
city and the rail because you're going
to have a lot of people coming here and
enjoy join this location there's open
areas here walk in the park cabinet
having a beer and shopping and bringing
home some plans or shrimp or whatever
Randall sells
if that street is closed it's not going
to matter well the Street's all going to
have circulation because the street is
going right through here
the Street's going
right around the whole site see all that
see right now this is blocked off here
that's going to be opened up
the developer is going to open it up and
you're going to have circulation this is
a public street right through the middle
here
okay so the streets are all going to be
open and circulating the square right
now and um and then for
um Mr Harmon former councilman Harmon
owns the property here
and
Mr Scarborough I offered to make some
additional parking right here
for Mr Harmon if he that goes and starts
to rent out
boat slips again
there will be
watching parking right on the site right
here for him that was part of the
proposal to the planning board
the street is closed it's not going to
matter
well this street this street here is
open right because it goes through like
this so there's access all the way
through the claiming towards all the
planning application now you can do also
while you're there talk about the
opportunities
the opportunity zone is probably not
going to be part of that project because
that's already more than halfway through
to the approve it was a 10-year time
period so some of those benefits
um you know the problem with the
opportunities especially in the state of
New Jersey they are not they were not
contusive to the way you had to deploy
your dollars somebody had us the
investors had to sell their games sell
their assets sell their stocks sell
their apartment building and they had
six months or something to deploy that
money into a project
um you know where it works well it
worked well on people that own multiple
um apartment and Commercial properties
that they could trade them amongst their
own LLCs because and then rehabbing
because those properties existed it
takes so long in New Jersey to get
approvals
that it makes it very difficult to
deploy opportunities on the money
because today the same folks saying uh
developers to take place
you're getting the numbers in reference
to the product program for 30 years I
asked you a question as the product
program was not in existence and the
developer still wanted to do business
how much would a Pleasantville begin
um it's a good question I I think we
would not have a project because I
was going to be getting unless you can't
answer that not that we won't be having
a project and I'm saying if Mr uh
Scarborough said November 30th here I'm
still going to do business here how much
would the city of Pleasantville be
retaining from I guess the answer would
be because it's a it's a good question
so your your assessment is based on what
your property is worth
so the higher those taxes are the lower
that property is worth you all know to
own houses in town if you if you own a a
hundred thousand dollar house in
Pleasantville and you're paying 78 000 a
year in taxes twice worth a hundred
thousand taxes were three thousand it
would be worth 160. so you could say oh
okay well he's going to put a 30 million
dollar project up and it's worth 30
million I add valorum taxes it would not
be worth 30 million it'd be worth half
that maybe
maybe less and I'm saying they couldn't
build it because as we spoke about the
gross revenue
you remember there's gross revenue but
then there's operating expenses and then
there's Debt Service
that has nothing to do with us no it
does but but you should have to pay that
no I'm still I'm still waiting you want
to do business
so if they call us to do it we're gonna
have water with this tonight oh can we
finish our dialogue sir
no we're going to have order that is
important
the question that I proposed I was
looking for an answer but if you can't
answer so be in the case I I do not give
an answer to I don't know what the value
would be I don't the value would not be
what it costs to build it would be lower
yes and
we can agree to disagree
those items the um can I ask you a
question
can I ask you a question just a common
sense questions
is it is the responsibility of the
citizens of this city to fund that
project
um
I think
I don't think it's just the decisions of
the sea don't have to redo anything so
it's that's not it's it's a decision on
whether or not you want a new project
new rooftops and additional Revenue to
the city so you know in my opinion do I
think it's a good idea yes but I can
agree that some people don't think it's
a good idea it's property considered
making for another 15-20 years
or or a lower end project can get built
or we can agree
ment okay thank you or we can agree to
meet in the middle and do something
reasonable that benefits the developer
and the people
the um
so let me go before I forget these
questions there was a young lady talked
about
ensuring the project
to be clear the agreement says
that if the developer or owner is in the
fall because once it's filled it's the
owner
that the city will work with the secured
lenders the mortgage company
and that the city is required to allow
the secured lenders to bring it out of
the fault
the secured lenders bring it out of the
fall and the city be required to allow
the secure lenders to change ownership
to manage the property
it later says that if the secured
lenders or the owner does not bring it
out of default the city has the right to
cancel the agreement and act just like
get actually any property tax owner
property tax payer property owner who
doesn't pay taxes you put a tax lien on
it you'd sell the tax lien someone would
prefer closing the property but the city
would terminate
the financial agreement and it would go
away the tax assessor would go down and
assess the property and that would be
the new assessment on the property so
the city's not guaranteeing any payments
to anybody on
the pilot
we um
how does it benefit the youth and the
seniors
I don't know if I can answer that in any
other way except that it's just bringing
additional Revenue to the city
it's bringing additional new
rooftops to the city with new people
more people
um I mean I think that's a benefit but I
guess that's I felt that the pain
the uh
um what is rooftop rooftops you know um
it's good food flashes just housing
rooftops it's a Redevelopment term you
bring housing units in with the hope
that people especially you know you
bring market rate higher end rental
units in those rooftops all carry the
other thing we say Wallace you're
bringing Wallace down people who have
some dollars to spend in the city which
help the restaurants and the stores the
Main Street and things like that that
and that's that's part of your
Redevelopment your Redevelopment goals
is to do that Sean do you want to
address anything with the plane itself
well I would just point out that the
plan is really
a book slot we'll talk a lot about this
component of the plan right here which
is the residential component this
component of the plan is the commercial
component which Rick mentioned
that's 9.4 acres and I I own that I've
owned that for three years
um
this is 25 acres in its entirety this
development that's been approved most of
it belongs to the city where's the Yacht
Club Yacht Club's right there and it's
sort of the hole in the donut but this
is all the cities
we've completed now and approval for
that
this is all the city's public marina and
we've made some planned improvements to
it it's truly not very functional right
now for several reasons all of which is
part of this overall plan
so 60 of this development
is public
public problem and this is helping carry
that forward and when it's done this
helps carry this forward
um so you don't own the commercial
portion of that no I own the commercial
portion up here it's 9.4 Acres with all
of this out here the water's edge and
back this way the park is owned by the
city
and planned and approved for those
improvements that you see on that excuse
me excuse me Scarborough could you who
are refer to departing the contractor or
agreement about the bike pulley
substation what's with the detail on
that and who will pay for the expenses
we we had that on the plan
it was two or three years ago and then
the the police didn't want the
substation they at that time said it'd
be nice to have a place for our folks to
duck in and have some shelter so we have
an idea of a breakfast sort of like a
coffee shop out here and we thought we
would do something with them in that
component there but it wasn't but it's
still an agreement
and and we can do it if they want it I
guess is the probably the best way is
that just being agreed upon and we um
say you're going to agree to go into
this agreement are you including that
element yeah I mean that's the that's
the building for it the degree of what
they wanted how far they want to take
that substation but there will be no
responsibility on the city too man not
at all it's all it's that's that's one
yeah the city and the planning board
during the process
because because that was something that
Scarborough said he would do but the
city didn't want the responsibility of
maintaining the building so that's why
that change as the Redevelopment plan
was approved so there's a new copy
without that I don't know which one you
have but but you have the proof site
plan you do what the city asks you to do
in the site plan approval and what Sean
is saying he can add to that building
right there to at least want a place but
that would be part of his his
responsibility because that would be his
building instead of having a separate
substation group at least
that's not true it would be perfectly
clear with that we talk about this plan
but this isn't approved
I have a decision resolution
I have all my cash for permits online
local permits on County permits only
Federal permits this is a site plan
approval that's complete the approval of
the actual work
that's complete that exists
this isn't an idea this isn't a cartoon
this this starts in three or four months
I'm asking if that these substation is
going to be deleted
then that plan no no no I'm not going to
speak to that now without I don't know
what you're looking at we have a
decision and resolution
it's been voted on
that's what we thought also in private
session they approve this project is
that what do you say now there's a
decision there's a site plan approval
that's been completed by by the Playboy
and Mrs Scarborough uh you know I do I
understand amazing like I said when I
spoke to watch you think it's a great
project I see I see how it could benefit
the community just by having something
of that caliber in our community but I I
think I share with my fellow citizens of
the city the fundamental issue that we
should be getting as you say four
hundred thousand dollars out of the deal
I say perhaps we should get more out of
there or if you're going to get a tax
amendment it shouldn't be for 30 years I
mean so many things could happen in the
30-year parent wears the value that
probably God forbid we have another
Sandy did something happening yeah the
prop the value of it can go to nothing
you know or it could be significantly
diminished this is so many dynamics of
what could happen and and another
element to that that concerns me is in
the truth in the traditional business as
I understand and when you pay property
taxes doesn't that become something that
you write off of your your taxes your
income taxes how come this is not just
being done in a more traditional way
that this because the papers say okay
you build it you pay your taxes and you
and you write the taxes off your income
tax we do I just don't understand why
you must have this problem which we're
physically deprives
um the city over the long term like 75
percent of the revenues that they would
otherwise get I don't get that yeah
I have a question I have a question has
anyone considered
how this would affect our children in
the school system
and already
overpopulated or close to being
overpopulated South Main Street school
possibly Washington Avenue Street School
how is this going to affect the school
district
how is are we going to hire
the city council more police officers
firemen
teaching those schools
has anyone considered that are we going
to have an ambulance service
more people no we don't have an
ambulance no we're going to have one now
we used to have an ambulance service
okay
we used to it
sir you did a comparative analysis with
Absecon
Hills and EHT is that what you said to
come up with they were the neighboring
yeah
it um they went through planning and
sometimes playing the board says
contended upon you doing certain things
you met all those needs at this point
and what are the next steps this this
plan has full planning board approval
and is fully
um permanent through Catherine the state
um I think the next approval is building
permits right it's a submission of
building permits to the building
department and they can start building
okay so I put it done with what I was
saying to Mr Scarborough so as far as
2021
the municipal share of Levy for
Northfield was 29 for EHT
18.9 for Absecon
31.9 but Pleasantville is 62.2 percent
so it votes asking how could that be a
proper comparative analysis right
because that's just a portion that it
breaks
right that's right
effective tax
the effective tax rate in Pleasantville
right now is 4.79 Right second highest
there lies the property
if it was 2.8 percent
maybe we wouldn't be here again and it's
a download spiral when you start to lose
your radiable base right which is it's
always
commercial rateables are easiest to
understand because it's no trash no kids
right well I'll answer your question
these units will ran between 18 and 1900
right there the mix generally is 60 40
60 percent who is 40 for what a single
single bedroom
they just don't generate school children
because the option for somebody at
nineteen hundred dollars a month is I
can either rent a single family home or
I can buy a significant
let's say there's zero kids but just to
give you a sense of it the council is
was good enough to this project and me
personally to go and visit the
Pennsauken project which was very
similar yeah a lot of I was involved I
was a code code
it has on average over the last three
going on four years I've had ten or less
kids with 250 even brand new knocked out
beautiful years it's a whole different
demographic it's a whole you're right
it's not the not the community is it in
fact compare it you can look it up on
your phone economically it's a very
similar demographic the whole
demographic that I'm accommodate towards
is
a new apartment building costs a lot to
build like any new anything cost to
build you gotta rent it from work it
just it's it's in general a different
consumer than a family of four would use
for the same dollar you can get more
space
all right for the same in the same
community
so that's just the mix that's what
happens so it's not a Kmart or a Walmart
where there's absolutely nobody living
there but they're relative to the value
created and you know in this case Money
Paid it's very very limited
being on a school tournament so let's
just say it's 180 units there are 30
school-aged children let's just say that
would be a 660
000
gross expense to the school district
well I say 18 1960 which is not true I
just told you 258 units just delivered
in the last four years same economic
situation same change
it's 10 or less kids
10 kids at 22 000 per kid that comes out
to 220
000 so then that's gross cost to the
school this year so then my question
would be what is the net benefit to the
city for the payment that the pilot
payment it'd be like another two hundred
thousand dollars with the commercial
what's the net benefit to the city do
you have those figures
you can't you can't know those figures
because you just did an assumption no no
no based on because that's why I asked
about the financial
projections that is supposed to be done
then it's it's 378 Plus
whatever I mean it's north of 400 000
North 400 000. I think the questions
have been answered and and more than
likely it's not going to be to your
liking it I don't think that's what
happened
my question was they haven't been
answered
my question answers
excuse me uh Rick one of your answer to
say apologize I got this piece of paper
from this parenting back here and this
kind of concerns me and it basically
says that if anything goes wrong that
the city has to alleviate the problems
and fix it ourselves and I know I never
saw this in the agreement and I just
want to know you know how does this work
because this is not good this doesn't
look good on paper
someone would have to show me that in
the agreement there's a specific area in
the agreement
that states that if there's a default
the city works with
the secured lenders the mortgage company
to allow them to correct it the poll we
have to allow them to correct at the
fall
and or allow them to transfer to
somebody who will correct it to fall if
the default is not corrected the city
cancels the agreement and does the same
as it does with any delinquent taxpayer
because it says here that was supposed
to be formed actions on behalf of the
company so that's a little tricky right
there yes the
um
remedies upon the fourth section 13.02
correct
that's what it is no Financial emergency
that section yeah what's the numbers
the financial emergency
never know nothing about
it
not anymore
um
where did you get that off of because
they're saying that's not here
that was often the agreement that you're
about to approve that's where it's from
unless there's a new one out there
that's off of the doctor
thank you
foreign
[Music]
thank you
very much
this is one of the things I was
concerned
because I have a whole lot of things I'm
concerned about but this one yeah
I can tell you um
certificate of formation
um number nine item number nine
and it says the company is subject to
the provisions of section 18 of public
law in 1991 citation 431
um and then it also cites um 48 20-18
respecting the powers of the city of
Pleasantville to alleviate financial
difficulties of the company or to
perform actions on behalf of the company
upon the determination and financial
emergency now that statute 40 2018 goes
into more detail of what this what
defines a financial emergency and it
talks about things like in case of
mismanagement and things like that of
the of the entity then that's when it's
in turn of why and then the local
Finance board would then come in as an
Arbiter to decide how this needs to be
resolved and it's a binding of decision
that's what the statute says if our
lawyers don't even know this this should
be a table that's part of the
certification y'all please table this
exactly
it's not part of the agreement it's part
of the certificate of formations
you know
well that's part of the formation
document that's required by the state
um
[Music]
we have finished the Q a from our
professional now we're still open for
public hearing anyone that wants to come
forward and speak their name for the
record
um please do some
goody good good night
Crystal Noel
so um I'm all for redevelopment
but I just want to make sure that
the fair share is given to the city
because it was not too long ago that I
found out that there was economic
inequality with the sewer payments right
which to the tune of a hundred over a
hundred thousand dollars every year was
being missed in Revenue
on for the city's benefit
so who was an attorney who reviewed this
document and represents the interest of
the city
the financial agreement on this right
here freshman
what other um things have you done for
the city recently people playing the
court attorneys so he's
if you agree to this as it stands with
any error errors what supersedes the
words or the numbers
so you don't know
the way it's formula that I can't answer
that question and again I didn't like if
there are figures in there maybe there's
an author or not right or there's Words
which ones you can see
the calculation in the section that
calls over the annual service charge is
what supersedes the numbers are purely
as they say proforma estimates okay what
is the net benefit to the city I mean I
would think that Mr
His Name Escapes Me
Barry I would think he would have that
so that's why I keep asking
um how many jobs will be created long
term only 20 so when we say it's
creating jobs it's not it's the short
term
um
so as far as Aesthetics yes that's great
but I just think that we are too busy
just looking and looking and appearing
desperate like oh you have some stuff we
gonna take whatever's you gives us
because we've got nothing else I don't I
think we should set our value 30 years
what is this perversion with 30 years
that is to the detriment of the city I
think that the figures need to be
renegotiated to create a little more
economic equality I do not think it's
fair that we burden this small little
town with 30 years and then for the half
of it it's what less than 40 of the tax
value that's not fair that's not fair at
all renegotiate the figures
thank you
yes my name is Tim Jones again I would
just like oh did you go on directly
supporting what Miss Noel just said with
regards to the fact that the city should
just get more out of the deal as you
decided on the top video we get 400 000
a year out of that
um cut it cut it down to two hundred
thousand dollars if he's gonna say well
we're giving the school board expense
200 000 of Revenue there's a fee
associated with this deal where Mr
Scarborough will make more than a City
off of this deal every year as one
person one person will make more than
this whole city makes off of this deal
and if you transferred that person will
it make more money off this deal than
the whole city of Pleasantville that
doesn't seem like Equity especially if
we have a master plan that says actions
like this are supposed to give Revenue
ongoing revenues in a form of
significant ratings significant
rateables is not two hundred thousand
dollars so I decided for 30 years
okay
um my question wasn't answered
how is this deal
the benefits of
the developer going to help
this city
the youth the senior citizens
how is it going to help us have we taken
in consideration
supporting the presidential Board of
Education and building a new school
are we going to hire new police officers
are we going to hire
D where is all this going to come from
his tax abatement how is that going to
help this city
how
what is the plan for Main Street
for the tax abatement
what is it
do we have the answers for that they're
looking out for themselves yeah they're
not looking out for Pleasantville
anytime you compare at seek at Somers
Point Northfield it's
come on it doesn't make any sense
Pleasantville is in a whole different
ballgame
and I hate to say it Major League
Baseball Negro League Baseball well
there it is yeah I hate to say it but it
is what it is
you cannot compare Northfield Absecon
Linwood to Pleasantville you just cannot
do it
not that one is there
and I don't appreciate being brushed off
without for the Youth
right I don't appreciate being brushed
off with that flimsy uh uh uh non-caring
response I really don't that's right
y'all full of crap
yes there's more people from the public
ly speaking
don't even come here if you're not
interested in the youth and the senior
citizens
I want to know if
the pilot deal was off
would these would this company still be
interested in building
or
if the pilot deal was somewhat off okay
we'll let you do it for five years
and then the other then after the fifth
year then you start paying full-blown
taxes I'm not against beautifying this
city no I just suffered into it I'm just
not against it the plans are absolutely
gorgeous
I absolutely get it but I don't get it
at my expense
I don't get multi-million dollar
corporations coming in
paying little to no taxes for 30 years
who does that if I miss one soil bill
you want to put a lien on my house
one sore Bill if I miss it for a whole
year I I know you gonna damn near take
it
but they don't have to pay
for 30 whole years
can you bring the number down I want it
to be beautiful
but not like this
not like this just not like this
how many of us got 30 more years to live
in this city how many of us estimate
if we believe we gonna get old 30 more
years we're going to leave this burden
on our kids
and our children's children do you my
child is not going to stay in
Pleasantville for the high taxes and
everybody else is getting a free ride
they're not going to do it I'm going
I was my home because my child will
refuse to pay taxes because people like
smart girls making a whole lot of movies
on
bring us to the table
let us help you decide we voted you to
be for the people that's right
for the people you took an oh
you
and you say and you said so help me God
you said it I didn't make you say I
didn't make you run
and I'm not hollering at you I'm not
I'm just so tired
of giving away my firstborn
foreign
certificate for the state but the city
has a default provision in the financial
ring so it representative certificate
it's a certificate but it's not in the
agreement right so as of November
the 28th 2022 Mrs Scarborough seven of
this is no longer in agreement that
agreement is his certificate of
formation with the state of New Jersey
oh it's not an agreement the housing is
burnt down excuse me the city executes
that's his formation document
um thank you I am confused
that wasn't working now question Council
uh business administrative mayor anybody
that can answer this man the bills go on
Main and um Washington Avenue that's
what 30 years tax debate me too
how much did we benefit from that
that's been in existence for a little
while now so how much did you benefit
from it the net the Netflix
taxes have gone up
okay if that's an example of food for
the pudding then maybe we should Resort
Helsinki
because right now it's
not a good deal for Pleasantville and in
the pilot program it does speak about it
doesn't have to be 30 years it can be
five years it's four that's right new
development that's right it says for the
new development this is the new
development it could be five years if we
are negotiating it's like if you you
negotiating both sides get it bring
forth man Mr janetti is the um assault
am I right sir for president yes
um
did you tell thank you for fighting with
a set of 30.
we talked about all different kinds of
terms we've seen all kinds of different
numbers that's why in this agreement
there's built-in step UPS as you guys so
so the front of you thing that must have
got stepped over
30 years
yeah I think that's what happened uh
each council person Mr Swan good evening
thank you for your service for you that
you've been here so disrespect for
anyone
councilman councilman councilman
president can you make a motion to turn
his mic up turn this volume because he
can't hit record and ladies did a
council women
you do have the due diligence to
table is to own speaking reference to
the 30 years and why not for five years
we negotiate because ladies in the
making everything's been approved and
it's going to be built and the way he
said it it was like it's gonna be built
without your approval yeah yeah
so correct me if I'm wrong the way I
heard that
so can it be built without your approval
council president and councilman and man
no okay misspoke
all right so
again
because I also heard this before
plans already that are 30 years can
somebody tell me what those four plans
are that 30 years all my babies that's
already in existence because this would
be fine can somebody tell me what size
are they I know Main Street in
Washington is one what's the other three
yeah
very frustrating the chairing Center
yeah let him just okay
um from First Street uh the Church of
the St Peter's Church okay obviously the
Housing Authority okay
um that's they're all at no six in hopes
up so so are we benefiting from that you
know
am I right you may get more but you may
not have the project so so to me it's
like crystal ball which I don't have
going on here
I can't tell you what you could have
been getting right I can't tell you what
we will be getting but you know I can
tell you now what we are getting what we
are getting from what we have now I'm
fixing the third year but if it wasn't
30 years we know that we will get more
[Music]
table is for now
anyone else
Urban Moreno Rodriguez Pleasantville New
Jersey
Pleasantville City Council
we've had strip clubs in this city
now a marijuana growing site
you voted on a trash transfer site by
the way not too far away from your new
building right
who told you Pleasant Hill needed a tiki
bar
teeny bars don't help feed our families
and kids in Pleasantville New Jersey
build a museum open a bookstore a tiki
bar no one found that offensive who in
Pleasantville needed a tiki bar take
that to Ocean City yeah oh wait you can
and by the way Mr Genetti my question
was not answered
you had 18 years
to pick up the phone to send an email to
contact tax abatement experts social
economic welfare experts professors
pilot program experts you have how many
pilot programs in the city four four
eight eight four
I'm sorry you can't across the street in
City Center is for because each
building's got its own four okay but
don't worry but if these programs have
never been studied before and I hope I'm
wrong I really hope these programs have
been studied and the research is there
to back up your vote today
voting on another tax abatement program
is fiscally irresponsible I'm sorry if
you don't have the research to back it
up mayor you can't vote on it
and after 18 years I hope that lawyers
hired to represent the city in these
negotiations I don't know
Mr Genetti but I hope we have better
answers than what if your taxes go down
I think I can't answer that if this
project is successful if rents go up
probably I cannot answer up to debate
these are all things I heard tonight
I hope after 18 years our lawyers have
more affirmative statements on a program
that we're on all going to be paying for
thank you
um I just have something I don't know
I'm real tired so bad with me tonight
why is it every time we kind of do a
deal that's supposed to benefit
Pleasantville
that we really don't benefit we end up
paying higher taxes
are they trying to push us out so they
can bring who they want in
and why can't you come up with something
as opposed to making a community within
a community and separating the people
why can't you come up with something
that will benefit everybody why can't
you do something or make some
contingencies in these and these deals
that you make that they sponsor the
football field or they sponsor this or
they do so I don't hear anything where
we are going to benefit directly all I
hear is our taxes are going to go up
because they don't want to pay taxes
right
and my taxes go up every year
so like you got to stay different
this I don't think this is going to work
and then you're going to put if this
feels so Atlantic City to me
it just feels tourist section and Airbnb
yeah tour section and the rest of them
so you take care of that section and
it's all beautiful but it's starting you
can't even see it from Main Street
thank you
and if you live across Main Street you
go all the way the police in that little
coffee bar they will chase you out
so I think you need to reconsider the
council and I'm dead I'm doing a dead
Series yeah
yeah I think you need to reconsider and
think more about the city as a whole
then one little small section and stop
giving it away for so much for so long
we've been helping you all about all
this time nobody complaining to come in
here saying anything about higher taxes
because the taxes go up every year the
school taxes go up every year the school
ain't even ever paying defense in the
last 22 years
so like do something for us
and our kids make us happy let us have a
part of it not just one person making
all the money
they don't pay no taxes and for nothing
he makes money and walks away with it we
even sell it to somebody else to leave
thank you
and we get nothing
can I come back up
again
that's not a question I mean you said
they would be
I don't remember the years
when you said that there would be no
kids you thought
are you trying to gravitate what our
community is
who's sort of come in who do you have
planned to come in here like you know
who makes this kind of money that can
come and go into these rooftops and
everybody's talking about and visiting
the teeth
where are these people coming from what
communities
from the general demographic Area
15 miles from here so 15 miles from here
so starting here out 14 miles in general
so you're saying people from Linwood and
Summers
um
and rent one of these places
[Music]
you know I just worry about our
commitment because will they be able to
yeah you know maybe someone wants to go
to the Tiki Bar are they going to be
able to go to the TV bar no what if
there's trouble on the when these places
go up and they need security like you
know police station put in because you
have the Tiki Bar you had the rooftops
and everybody wants to come there and
it's a trouble
you know you know I say that there's no
trouble person but I'm gonna tell you
what happened obviously when the council
meetings we left one night and I was out
here talking
and you're saying how safe our street is
there was a shooting
that was right there on the corner right
where where those places are in a great
building I know some of you know it
because Mr Mr Ricky you told me to get
in my car because there was a man
running down the street saying there's a
man that was just shocked
I'm just concerned about the security
here in Pleasantville already we don't
have enough to cover all the areas and I
think that with putting something there
it's going to cause more of a problem
because you're not going to want the
people of Pleasantville in that
development because this is the
development for certain yeah a bunch of
people not the people are Pleasantville
no so my thing is if this is what's
going to happen why don't we just sell
our homes and go into this building
yeah I'm just asking yeah
so that's my only concern is that if we
really need to think about what we're
doing I know everybody wants to to build
up the ocean the beach from the
lakefront whatever you want to call it
but I think it's some things that we
have to really look at and I couldn't
figure out why it had to be 30 why
couldn't it be 15.
thank you
[Music]
yeah
can I get a minute folks
um council president my name is
Christian Moreno Rodriguez I'm actually
an Atlantic City resident
we have family here in Pleasantville New
Jersey uh and we have our home here also
in Pleasantville New Jersey
um
sometimes I I honestly think you guys
saw yourselves short sometimes
because when you're Pleasantville strong
you know we've shut down Bad actors
we've you've hoped you've hosted amazing
charity drives you've been there for the
kids sometimes you've done what you have
to do to provide for your own people
so why do you act like you need this man
yeah
councilman Carmona you're out there
every other day at the bus terminal
right here on Main Street
you see our people are suffering
every day and you're there to console
them
and you honestly think this man and his
money is gonna address that
you honestly think that property that's
self-segregated
is going to do anything for the people
that you're trying to help
when the analysis is showing it's going
to cost us way more than it's bringing
in
how are those people that you're helping
every single day
benefiting from this counseling promoter
forget about us
how are those people getting the help
they need from this project
because that's what you ran on
that's why we voted for you
you have an amazing soul and you're out
there every day like a soldier sometimes
and you honestly believe this property
the self-segregated property this Tiki
Bar is going to do anything for the
people
secretary
honestly everyone
councilman Carmona just won his
re-election so he's going to be here for
another couple years
it's time to take the training wheels
off I know you want part of the original
negotiations yes
I I'll give you that you weren't a part
of the original negotiations this
happened way before you same thing for
you councilman Correa you weren't a part
of it
but you have an opportunity to
force yourself to be part of the process
we need you you have to stand up and
defend us that's why we elected you
that's why you knock on our doors
we know you have good Souls
we know you inherited this mess
but don't you think
guys we need you
councilman Swan respect to your years to
servitude and your time's up
we hope you have a good retirement
but let's table this let's
not have to be the meeting where we sell
off this property
we have an incoming councilman coming in
he stated his intentions against it
I mean at the very least can you at
least tell me did you read this contract
do you agree with it
I mean where do you guys stand sometimes
I feel like you say nothing
and just hide
that's not what we elected before
Council for money we start with you
please stand with the people
before I get to this next one here
we've been going for over an hour and 15
minutes
we apologize
and I think it's fair for all the
residents to be here all night but you
have a duty that's public service
to listen and you have the opportunity
right now looks like the city council is
divided against the community
he has the opportunity to bring him
together by saying let's table this and
work together he has the opportunity
that's what I'm putting it on the person
that can make a decision so I'm asking
you again
when you consider
holding this back until there's a
community benefits agreement and people
of the right Minds as well as Council
can come together where you can say this
yes or no no okay you're a good neighbor
your example of a good neighbor and
that's what we want to be here thank you
he said no but he don't want to work
with he don't want to be a lady but he
wants our tax debate man
so which is an intermission we just lost
part of your Council so we want to hear
you but we want to make sure everyone is
here to hear you as well that's all out
of respect for what everyone has to say
too that's
um
this process this type of thing is never
easy and I don't think everybody
needs and desires gonna be met
I just believe you're gonna have to
arrive at a happy meeting if you can and
be reasonable
um however I would employ the council
again to please look at the specifics
the nuts and books and the details of
this plan because
we've had many promises of things in
this County that was going to make it
better and it hasn't you know what they
cast when they passed the casino
referendum years ago it was supposed to
lower taxes to build a community it
didn't Maxine streets are horrible
you know when they pass that windmill
project it's supposed to lower our
electric bills it didn't
you know there's been so many things
that have been proposed
and I don't know if it was just
oversight on the part of the committee
members or the council members of
Atlantic City or different
municipalities or if it was just it just
didn't work out but this is why we need
to look at the details like like really
really hard and maybe like someone
suggested bringing a professional
because
theory in reality sometimes
far far apart
and it's never going to be perfect
but we're always supposed to be striving
for the first
and the only way you can do that is it
can't be all your ways they can't
absolutely
and it can't be all our way we know that
we're just saying let's be reasonable
and look at this plan and get rid of all
the Bad actors in it
and flesh out the problems the
inconsistencies
because they're saying one thing but
they're document you know when you sign
that document
that is what becomes wrong
so the promises verbally mean nothing
you're hearsay and admissible's evidence
this wasn't that document so we got it
really gotta
dig in that thing my heart
because
they say the devil's at the details but
God is in the details too
success
yeah you were open if you didn't have a
council member thank you
occurrences
um
councilman Sam and Swan I wish you the
best
I wish you the best Mr councilman
Stanley Swan is something going to miss
you uh God bless
um
I would just like to say that for this
development of that track 255 or that
fly fly I'm for it I'm for development
of that whatever
uh it sounds like a good deal to me I'm
not happy about 30 years but I
understand it I understand
um after we uh reviewing some some
literature about it I have a better
understanding of it some people like to
have a lesser lifespan of that abatement
but it is what it is
um my youngest daughter graduated from
the high school the high school was
there in 1995. that spot has been
thinking since 1995. so we need to do
something
consumers
I'd like to make a motion
the table
ordinance 24 for further review
okay
exactly second day of course
roll call Swan
stand
it's bad before yes devil wear yes
Thomas yes Pomona yes Korea yes
sister yes okay it's uh oranges number
two has been table no no no no no no no
no no okay so good now rephrase
that wasn't hurtful that was that's
that's not what you said
yeah
pay attention please yeah
again for table yes swan
okay Davenport yes
yes Thomas yes cavona yes Korea yes
or this number 24 is table
resolution 199 creating a current
account temporary budget for 2023.
motion
real close one yes dashboard yes yes
Thomas yes yes
you're too hard to create in a civil
utility temporary budget for 2023. of
course you can't hear
[Music]
yes resolution approved resolution 201
authorizing implementation of a
corrected action plan for 2021 annual
audit motion second
no
so know that kimono yes Korean yes
resolution fruit resolution to 202
including this settled probably known as
block 135 Lot 8 and
19.02 also known as
172-186 North Main Street and 184 North
Main Street and then amount of 240 000
dollars
questions
um
yeah resolution 205 204 205. okay so
I've been put a small broker yes
Davenport yes yes
Korea yes this is Trump
revolution first
about 29 also known as 145 East Delilah
Road in the amount of 82 500.
00 dollars
motion second
Swan yes Dad before yes come around yes
Thomas yes Pomona yes a quick question
to work with
yes
[Music]
congratulations approved the next one is
the items that you all have discussed in
work session
yeah
residents are 204 this is the item you
all talking about
we're going to say oh can I have one
order please I'll probably sell property
loan is block 95 block 20. also known as
11 Clinton Avenue is about 6 500 dollars
cable
okay second by Thomas
Davenport yes yes Thomas yes kimono yes
Korea
yes
okay you're a yes okay this
resolution has been tabled resolution
205 approving the sale probably those is
block 93 block 15. also known as 16
Cameron Avenue the mountains five
thousand five hundred dollars
yes
resolution has been tabled
resolution 206 authorizes the mayor of
city clerk to execute an agreement with
the county of Atlantic Municipal
alignment second branch
yes
resolution
207 authorized the submission of
application for the New Jersey
Department or Human Services Division on
mental health and Addiction Services
grant funding second
roll call Swan yes
Davenport yes have an alarm yes Thomas
yes Corona yes Korean yes sister
resolution approved resolution 208
support for the suitability of cannabis
build business equality cannabis LLC
second
roll call Swan yes Davenport yes yes
Thomas yes Pomona yes Korean yes sister
yes resolution of Peru resolution 200
not provided for Budget transfer for
2020 Appropriations and the sewer fund
motion
second
squirrel called Salon yes Davenport yes
development yes Thomas yes kimono yes
Korea yes is strong
resolution approved resolution 210
provided for Budget transfers for 2022
appropriations of the current fund
second roll call Swan yes Davenport yes
demolar yes Thomas yes Kubota yes Korea
yes is this strong yes resolution
approved resolution 211 adopted a
certain time the update and review of
various sections of the Personnel policy
and procedures manual motion seconds
roll call Salon yes dashboard yes
demolaro yes common yes Pomona yes Korea
yes restaurant yes
resolution of two I need a motion to
approve the bill list for sure
yes
Davenport yes probably yes Thomas yes
kimono yes Korea yes this is strong yes
resolution emotion approved motion to
approve be more raffle life okay second
a real cold Swan yes Dad support yes
Kevin allowed yes Thomas yes Pomona yes
Korean yes system motion approved next
is public portion there should be no
more it should be because I have the
concern
I have a concern about this
right here so even if we keep 30 years
on this since we tabled it I think the
percentages should shift because for it
to be 10 from year 1 through 15.
that's not acceptable and then through
16 year to 21 only 20 of Revenue that's
a slap in the face so two-thirds of what
the revenue is generated is only at 20
or less
two-thirds of the agreement the schedule
needs to be changed why because we need
to increase how much we're receiving
that's right right we need to increase
it here's the reason why because we
can't even afford a crossing guard isn't
that right mayor Ward when you told City
officials uh the from the United States
official when you told the school board
officials that you couldn't afford a
crossing guard for the students to be
safe as self-made on Broad Street we
don't got no money is that right we're
in a deficit right Barry
so at this point I feel as though there
needs to be a state takeover and if
there is a state takeover people need to
be given pink slips
the administrator needs to be getting a
pink slip and the accountant needs to be
given fixed up if the state takes over
because this is not right we need to do
this right the percentages need to work
out to benefit
everyone that lives here not just the
big business and the corporations
getting tax breaks what makes the
difference between a Republican and
Democrat you're going to do the same
thing give tax breaks to the wealthy
it's not fair South Main Street School
needs another crossing guard
Ian sir
come on yeah
um a younger man came into the police
department do you know I had a prior
conversation in reference to why there
is no officer Sydney move at my
conversation with Chief which is fair
you said that um it's more beneficial to
have officers on the street to sit in
that room
Pleasantville was about to be sued
a young man off the streets came to the
bathroom
passed out his mind was looking for him
couldn't find him
got to the point whenever he got to that
point her husband
would have came into the bathroom and
seen the lady's son
I think about two weeks ago two or three
weeks ago tried to wake him up he
wouldn't wake up he runs outside and
says he won't wake up
the mama gets out the car goes into the
men's bathroom
kick his feet
wouldn't kick him again then they
move
she lift him up
carried him and took him to Lincoln City
hospital the doctor said that she
wouldn't have brought him he would have
died in the bathroom
the doctor also said
no disrespect to you
Pleasantville would have been sued
I'm thinking the bathroom the police
department here is a safe Zone because I
gave a chief Joker running down the
street trying to bust my head in with a
bag I run into the police department
help him help nobody's here
[Music]
like I said Chief is best to have a
Ministry but what I'm saying is you as
far as we Face Pleasantville is between
the catch 22. if you don't put nobody in
there somebody running into gotta this
is the same time if you run in there and
nobody's there and somebody dies and I'm
not an attorney
people might get sued big time
so what I'm saying I know he's short on
staff
I think we're gonna have to take uh
the most sensible uh
uh move they have to bite the bullet and
say we gotta have somebody in there food
anybody coming to Pleasantville will you
run into the police department you're
going for help
if you got to pick the phone number wait
for a dispatch dance in front of whoever
I'm done
who's that for is the question but not
saying fault I'm saying something needs
to be fixed it needs to be fixed fast
because from our prior conversations
been a while
okay now we got to that point and now
this took place so man business
administrator Council people turn cheat
[Applause]
gotta do something because you was this
close to being sued because it was that
close to dying
[Music]
yes I want to say Merry Christmas to
everyone
congratulations against one of your
retirement and everyone have a safe and
healthy holiday
Merry Christmas to everybody I heard
something the other day that I just have
to
somebody there was a saying on a
hospital wall in Africa and when people
die and they go to meet whoever you pray
to whoever you believe in
they say show me your scars
and when the person says I don't have
any scars the person says
wasn't there anything in your life to
fight for
we all need something to fight for we
all need to make our town just a little
bit better
Merry Christmas swanny I'm going to miss
you
I just want to wish everybody a Merry
Christmas and a Happy New Year and I
just want to
so you know everybody here and it was
great working with you
know it was a great fun
Merry Christmas to everybody have a
blessed and safe holiday
I'm here guys merry Christmas everybody
uh Happy New Year this morning we'll
miss you a couple little bit of dogs in
the morning and now that's cancer
thank you yeah so everybody just have a
happy and safe holiday
good luck
I
heard someone earlier say
um
uh that um the businesses in Ocean City
and what they do to for their Community
to thrive we don't have businesses like
that in Pleasantville we can't attract
economic development in Pleasantville
and tonight what happened with the
Spyglass project as far as Council voted
they voted their conscious but that's
something that
if I had a boot then I I can't say that
I would have abstained or voted no and
the reason is is because no one has come
here and so long I mean
Scarborough is here they're trying to uh
you know they're the pilot yes 30 years
is a long time 30 I I agree with that a
five-year abatement wouldn't it just
wouldn't be feasible for them to build
that way and all I'm saying is that we
need breedables and for the uh Pilots
that we have in the city right now
or they're better than was at the
property before we need the rateables
and I'm not saying for us to be a slave
for us to be anything lower than lower
in our standards but at what point do we
at what point do we just get variables
in here no one's coming knocking on our
door you know the economic development
and everything we need all of that and
until we start and and Mr Christmas was
here earlier and he everything that he
said in a nutshell we're getting the mod
uh Car Wash we have been working on the
um the Scarborough for so long and then
we have other projects that don't you
know that they're asking for Pilots as
well everyone's asking for pilots and
yes Scarborough has done other projects
in summers point and everything and they
all have they all have Pilots you know
I'm not trying to compare us with Ocean
City Northfield Linwood or anything like
that but I'm just saying to you all that
when we're not the only ones that ask
you know that's giving Pilots so we as
we try to um get gradables and do what
we're doing and you all are here and I
just employed to just know the whole
story know the whole story and figures
and everything rather than think that
we're just giving everything away for no
reason at all
Merry Christmas to everybody I hope you
have a fun safe holiday with your
families God bless you all
Christopher
yeah I I really believe that everything
has been said um wishing everyone uh
blessed last blessed Christmas holiday
councilman Swann congratulations on your
retirement from public service
um you've been around for a very long
time you've been very instrumental uh to
this community in more ways than many
people even know so congratulations and
God bless you
know for such a long time
done more than likely around 200 200
million projects
in the city of Pleasantville
for the past 20 years
a lot of times poorer communities kind
of
family school systems school districts
and things of their Natures is hard to
feel when you try to build like okay
who's going to send these kids to school
here
so you know you like a car between a
rock and a heart you just it's just hard
to do the development and it's hard to
come up with a great deal and so
do you just professional spicy face
it's the best bet your nose in spite the
face you won't have anything
maybe just a big old Dust Bowl we
wouldn't have it we wouldn't have had
anything
and that
should
n't
just a big old plus dust ball you
wouldn't have anything
so in this state
a lot of programs
they exist
and our neighbors they pick up a pile of
programs and they and they move their
communities forward whether you like it
or not
what they do
that's that's what that's the bottom
line to the to what they do and the
demographics the developers they
understand the demographic they come in
they see a partial land it hasn't been
development
God knows when you know and they look
and they say okay I can get that and I
can probably get a free deal on that
because they're not receiving the taxes
in front of them who's going to benefit
from it
because some of my money is better than
a whole lot of none of my money
you
it doesn't bother
this group to have a waterfront that has
not been developed
if you watch
in those past 20 years since
1995 to me 1995. if you watch this 1995
the things that have taken place
surrounding communities and the things
that they had done by Atlantic City that
Rebel wasn't there but God I wasn't
there Harris Building wasn't there if
you go back some time and everything you
didn't have the tunnel and things that
nature we got to do what we got to do to
make things and move things forward
you got we gotta have something
something to work with
we had to have ability to move projects
forward
and prior to
some people coming in on this
Administration we we moved projects
forward
we did what was best for the city of
Pleasantville what do you agree with it
or not
we did what was best for the city of
Pleasantville so you can be proud to say
hey that this is what happened here we
got to build some electric we got this
project right here we got that one
that's sitting back here zip it was left
up until to some people we wouldn't have
nothing
yeah let's just be a free spit straight
across Pleasantville
and no buildings that stopped to spit
the bottom line of this of this thing we
are set here to do what's best
foreign
I want to answer your question because
you said before who cares about the
seniors and who cares about the um the
youth and
that's what we're trying to do we're
trying to bring readables in to be able
to have more uh revenue for our youth
and our readables I mean as far as
making deals and everything is there I'm
sure there are things that we could say
not making deals I don't like saying
that but there are things that we can
negotiate to you know maybe get more for
our athletic programs but that's what
the readable still they'll bring in
revenue for us to be able to
um you know to have money for our youth
and our and our seniors that's very very
important to me too so I just I didn't
know you were still sitting there I I
understand exactly what you're saying
you can catch her after them
when I was whooping Pleasantville yeah
amp four banks no okay
and we are almost a shadow of ourselves
we have none of that now we don't have a
supermarket I agree with you anymore
um Merry Christmas to all those that
love the city of Pleasantville
Merry Christmas to your families and
it's just Merry Christmas to your kids
may you have a Happy New Year in
progress
I'm back with a better mindset for all
of us
entertain emotion to a journey
thank you
[Music]
thank you